Our death is not an end if we can live on in our children and the younger generation. For they are us, our bodies are only wilted leaves on the tree of life.
- Albert Einstein
[if you wish to contact me, my email address is: firstname.lastname@example.org]
Currently working on my mother-in-law's tree, mostly centred in Cornwall and London. It is essentually updates, having studied this tree in 2014/5 and 2016/7.
Tuesday 17th December 2019
Mabel Manhire, see 10th Apr 2017, nothing new, as she lived all her life in Devon, where Family Search have no scans
Maria Manhire, Jessie's great-aunt, see 11th Apr 2017, nothing new
Marion Manhire, see also 11th Apr 2017, nothing new
Mary Manhire, see 14th Apr 2017, who married and went to Australia.
Mary Ann Manhire, see 14th April 2017, at last a scan:
But I still cannot find her in 1841 & 1851 censuses - I thought I had in Portsmouth but she turned out to be a widow, and from Hampshire.
Monday 16th December 2019
Lilian Manhire, see 14th Jul 2012 & 7th Apr 2017, the cousin who married Jasper (see last Friday) and Jessie's aunt. Nothing new.
Lona Armenia Manhire, see same dates, nothing new
Lot Manhire x3, see 7th & 8th Apr 2017, nothing new
Louie Edith Manhire, see 14th Jul 2012 & 7th Apr 2017,
again nothing new
Lucy Manhire, see 10th Apr 2017, nothing new except a photograph of the stone in Roche Cemetery:
In case you can't see the inscription, it reads: In loving memory of Lucy, the beloved wife of John Cock, wo died at West End, Roche Jan 14 1912 aged 54 years One of the truest, one of the best, God in his mercy called her to rest. Also Cuthbert Charles, their youngest son, who died Feb 7 1899 aged 4 months.
Sunday 15th December 2019
Joseph Manhire 1, see 3rd Apr 2017, baptism scan:
Seeking out Rees Hill again, it appears to be at Trezaise, but Google Streetview doesn't go that way. There are footpath/bridleways leading across the fields but, as far as I can see, no houses.
Joseph Manhire 2, see same, again I couldn't find a baptism and again he seemed to be buried 3 days before death! These two dates are from different sources though.
Joseph Manhire 3, see same, many thanks to Linda Cane for the memorial card on Ancestry. It is always lovely to see something personal attached to these trees, it brings them to life so to speak.
oh, and I have his baptism scan:
Joseph Colman Manhire, see 4th Apr 2017, where I told his stories. This is all most amusing to me as this is my husband's tree and Joseph spent quite some time in the area frequented by my own ancestors in Dalby, Leicestershire - and met his end there. The other odd detail was that he received his "exposure" leading to discharge from the services at Sheerness, where his grand-niece Jessie ended up aftrer marriage into the Smith clan.
Her first cousin Kenneth Croydon Manhire, see also 4th April 2017, was another odd one, named Croydon, where Jessie lived for many years but I cannot see a link in 1907, when he was born in Cornwall. I have no scans, as this is too recent.
Leonard Manhire, see 10th Jul 2012 & 4th Apr 2017, nothing new
Lewis Cyril Manhire, see same dates, nothing new, nothing scanned. And in every record his wife was spelled Freeda, so it wasn't a typo. I have managed to find them in 1939 Register, together at 6 Virginia Terrace, St Stephen. At no. 2 Virginia Terrace was a Frederick & Elizabeth Best, but I can't see that they were related to Freeda. Lewis was a Clay Labourer, heavy worker, and Freeda UDD. There was a closed file too, but probably a lodger as I can't see that they had a child
Saturday 14th December 2019
John Manhire 2, see 28th Mar 2017, son of John1, far from confirming, I found other possibilities. However, I do know he had children so can discount some.
John Manhire 3, see same, was his son, and I had better luck with scans:
John Manhire 4, his son, see same date, I see that he was baptised on 15 Feb 1792 at St Austell, but can find no scan. I have one of marriage, though, which shows it was "with consent of their parents"
as Philippa was under 21 (by 10 months), he was 23. His burial scan shows his interment at St Dennis on 2 Sep 1863
he died 4 days prior to this and left <£50 to his son John, wife Philippa having died 10 years before. There was a John Manhire accused of larceny, twice acquitted in 1830 but found guilty in 1865, so if the same man it was evidently not him.
John Manhire 5, see same date, I can bring you baptism scan:
No scan of marriage or burial.
John Manhire 6, see 31st Mar 2017, Jessie's great great-uncle, nothing new
John Manhire 7, see 2nd & 3rd April 2017, where I gave a huge amount of information, including the stories of his 11 children. I cannot locate scans to add anything, so will leave this now.
Friday 13th December 2019
George Manhire 1, see 19th Mar 2017, Oliver's great-grandfather. Unfortunately no scans, and no new records
George Manhire 2, see 20th Mar 2017, his son, however, does have a baptism scan:
Unfortunately I still cannot track down a marriage, and the alternative names Hewitt & Trethewey for his wife don't help matters.
Gladys Manhire, see also 20th Mar 2017, Jessie's auntie, has nothing new, apart from the fact that her husband Emile served in the RAF, joining up on 8 Mar 1917, a mere 2 months before son Frederick was born.
Gladys Victoria Manhire, see 9th Jul 2012 & 20th Mar 2017, nothing new
Gordon Richard Manhire, see also 20th Mar 2017, one of Jessie's first cousins, had plenty of holes in his story, but the only thing I have achieved today is to discount the chap who sailed to & from New Zealand. He had the middle name of Henry, not Richard. It is very odd that he doesn't appear in his childhood. I have found 2 more records in the 1960s, when he was living at 4 Falconwood Road, Croydon with his mother Edith and May, but this doen't help fill the gap.
Hannah Manhire, see 21st Mar 2017, nothing new
Hetty Manhire, see also 21st Mar 2017, although no scans, I have managed to sort out her death. I have found a record dated 13 Apr 1950, stating she died at 5 Dartmoor Cottages, Wotter, Shaugh Prior, leaving effects worth £150 to Samuel, who registered her death at Plympton.
Hilda May Manhire, see 21st Mar 2017, nothing new again
Jane Manhire, see 9th Jul 2012 & 26th Mar 2017, and I also mentioned her with regard to her sister Ellen (see below). As she was baptised in Devon, I have no scan to bring you, likewise her marriage. She died in Calgary and was buried 2 days later in Union Cemetery.
Jasper Manhire, Jessie's uncle, see 28th Mar 2017, who confused matters by marrying his first cousin and thus linking up the twigs on this branch of the tree. He had a fascinating story, so please do look. I can't findanything new though.
John Manhire 1, see 28th Mar 2017, Jessie's 5xgreat grandfather, should have scans of baptism and marriage, on Family Search, but I suspect these have been withdrawn as I am coming up empty every time, even back then, prior to registration in 1837. A very sad state of affairs if this is the case...
Wednesday 11th December 2019
Emily Manhire, see 19th Mar 2017
As I said then, she was the youngest of the 14 children and did not go to USA with some of her siblings, but remained at home in Cornwall. There are no scans but when I mentioned her address at death was 17 Adelaide Street, I didn't realise it was her sister Elizabeth's home (see below).
Ethel Annie Manhire, see also 19th Mar 2017, I wasted a lot of time seeking out the baptism scan, as Family Search would only give me one of the file cover, not the document itself (no use to anyone), and she didn't marry there is nothing new to bring you.
(William) Ewart Manhire, see also 19th Mar 2017, nothing new
Felix Manhire, see 24th Mar 2017, he was registered in July quarter of 1864 in St Stephens, but I cannot find a baptism or scan of marriage or death. One thing I can do though isto fill in the gap I mentioned around 1891. As I said, Annie & Lot returned to England and can be seen in Cornwall in 1891 census with her mother, but Felix was naturalised in 1889 and appeared in the Directory of 1890 at the Works Power House at the Anaconda China clay Mine. He evidently left for UK before summer 1893, in time to conceive Ambrose, born the following spring. So they weren't there for long.
Frederick Manhire, see 5th Jul 2012 & 19th Mar 2017,
I gave a lot of detail previously, but he was similar to Felix in that he travelled across the Atlantic around the time of his marriage, which was confusing. I think he sailed back to UK in 1919, got married in 1920 then took his bride to Michigan and settled there. He also was naturalised in 1930 and remained there until he dided in 1963. Beatrice followed in 1982.
Tuesday 10th December 2019
Ella Manhire, see 3rd Jul 2012 & 18th Mar 2017, was baptised Ellen, like her mother, but was always known as Ella
An interesting thing about her emigration to USA was that she travelled out to New York on the same ship used 4 years earlier by her uncle Arthur on his trip, the SS St Louis
They sailed on 3 Nov 1915 fromm Liverpool, arriving in New York 11 Nov. Further information is now available on their deaths. William died in 1955 (I previously had his death date as 1942 but think "reports of his death are exaggerated" at that time) and was buried at Crown Hill Cemetery, Twinsburg, Summit County. Ella died on 1 Apr 1971 aged 93 and joined him in the grave
Ellen Manhire, see 18th Mar 2017, no scans as she was born in Devon, but Ancestry have found her marriage for me. In 1909 her sister Jane Hicks went out to Canada with her 3 children to join her husband (who was working there), and died the following year. Ellen had followed her a few weeks later and may have helped with her children. 1910 was rather a year for them, as Ellen married Frederick Vincent (Canadian record only gives the year) then her sister Jane died at Christmas, when her youngest child was not quite 3 years old. 1911 census shows her widower had moved the children in with his brother, so Ellen was free to marry.
Elsie Manhire, see 19th Mar 2017, sister of Ella above. Baptism scan:
but by 1901 census she had left home, but I still cannot locate her or her husband-to-be. On 31 Oct 1914 she married him in St Columb but I cannot find a scan, for that or burials for either.
Sunday 8th December 2019
Dorothy Manhire, see 15th Mar 2017, Jessie's first cousin. I have been searching Tehidy Road, Tywardreath again on Google Streetview, but to no avail as several houses are quite modern, very few have names and the numbering system has no doubt changed since 1939. No new records, I'm afraid.
Edgar Manhire, her brother, see also 15th Mar 2017. Searching for his wife Alice, I found an Alice Jeanne Baudet nee Derrien from St Helier, Jersey. She was married before, to Louis Joseph Baudet, and had a son with him by the name of Ronald. I cannot find his birth record, or her marriage, but both Louis & Ronald are buried in St Peter, Jersey.
Also I have found a burial record for her there, under the name of Manhire, the problem being that I had a year of birth for her as 1901 and it seems to be a typo for 1911. This makes more sense, as she was a similar age to Edgar. Edgar was also buried there, and the 1987 year given by another genealogist was probably a guess:
as he died on 9 Aug 1988. Alice died in 2004, Ronald in 2015.
Edward Manhire, see 2nd July 2012 &15th Mar 2017
Nothing new, I'm afraid, apart from the fact that he left £10,604 on his death.
Elizabeth Jane Manhire, see 15th Mar 2017, since which I have found her death and it was in 1946, as I suggested. Unfortunately no scans of birth, death or marriage, I am afraid.
Elizabeth Mary Manhire, see 3rd Jul & 6th Aug 2012,
I told the full story then with the help of another genealogist but can now add the 1939 Register, where they can be seen at 17 Adelaide Street, with her brother Charles next-door-but-one at number 13.
There is a redacted line in their household, no doubt Doreen, who is still alive, as I understand it.
Later: I have just discovered she died in 2014, aged 95.
Saturday 7th December 2019
Betty Joan Manhire, see 13th Mar 2017, Jessie's first cousin, nothing new
Charles Manhire, see 1st Jul 2012 & 13th Mar 2017, bottom right in yesterday's photo.
5 Adelaide Street
13 Adelaide Street
but no new records, I'm afraid.
Claude Manhire, see 1st Jul 2012 & 13th Mar 2017, Jessie's uncle. As I confirmed in 2017, he did in fact marry Grace Jones nee Underwood on 2 Jan 1916, despite it being wartime and he was serving aboard SS Campania as AB2. He was no doubt given leave as the ship was undergoing modifications in dock between Nov 1915 and Apr 1916 for service as an aircraft carrier. Other details I was not aware of when I covered his story before was the deaths of him and his wife. His death was registered, as I said, in the January quarter of 1941 in the Surrey Mid-Eastern area, postulating he may have been in hospital at the time. I have now seen the burial record
which states he died in St Ebbas Hospital, Epsom, which was at that time a specialist unit for epilepsy patients (later became a mental hospital under the NHS) and was buried at the Finchley Burial Ground (Islington Borough Council) on 26 Mar 1941. On 1 Oct 1964 Grace was cremated in Islington and her ashes buried with Claude.
David Manhire 1, see14th Mar 2017, baptism scan:
I am still struggling with this surname, and cannot bring you a scan of their marriage or his burial record, I am afraid.
David Manhire 2, see 2nd Jul 2012 & 14th Mar 2017, the boy sitting far right of photo below. I have a scan of his first marriage:
It shows the witnesses were his brother Edward and Thomas Eva, relative of bride's mother. Emily died in 1911 and was buried at Greenwood Cemetery, Kellogg
and David remarried:
As I said in 2017, he died less than 4 years later and Laura remarried. David died on 11 Jan 1923 at Murray Hospital, Butte of lobar pneumonia aged only 41
informant was his brother Arthur
(Murray Hospital in 1920s, now a car park)
Friday 6th December 2019
Annie Jane Manhire, see 30th June 2012 & 13th Mar 2017
Annie is bottom left. The only new document I can see is the passenger list for her journey to USA. She sailed on 4 July 1923, aboard the SS Majestic, 2nd class to New York, giving age as 34 (would be 35 a few weeks later), address as 5 Adelaide Street, Camborme and occupation as "Housework", intending to settle in USA. The ship docked on 10th July in New York and she stated her final destination was Detroit. I would say it wasn't surprising she was unhappy and returned to England in 1933; both her parents and baby daughter died between 1925 & 1929 and being aged 40 she was unlikely to have any more children. In 1939 Register I think she is the widow who is "paid housekeeper" to a retired draughtsman/marine engineer, at 3 Carclew View, Devoran, Truro.
Arthur Stanley Manhire (immediately above his sister in photo above), see same dates, also emigrated to USA.I have the scan of his marriage:
Most of the information on this document is dittoes; he was married on 19 Jun 1917 at Wallace, Shoshone, Idaho to Florence Bane, also living in Kellogg but born in Washington. The ages are a surprise, she was only 18, he 32! So it's not for the same reason that this couple only had one child too. I can now also see his WW2 draft, listed as 57 years old, living at 23 East Nevada Avenue, Detroit (on Streetview now a gap, the area run down and nearby properties boarded up), working for National Bank Building Co.
Betsey Manhire, see also 13th Mar 2017, Oliver's great-aunt, scan of baptism:
But none for marriage, as this took place in Devon. Burial:
and Samuel the following year
Tuesday 3rd December 2019
Yvonne Eugenie Marjorie Knight, see 10th Mar 2017, nothing new
Zerua Rosina Knight, see 26th June & 29th Oct 2012, also 10th Mar 2017, scans:
So, having now completed the update of the Knight branch, it is time to redo the main stem of this tree, the Manhires. Unfortunately, records from Devon have not been scanned by FamilySearch, so again I will look for Cornish ones etc.
Alma Manhire 1, see 12th Mar 2017, nothing new as all records from Devon (see above)
Alma Manhire 2, Oliver's 1st cousin once removed, not covered before, was born Jan 1859 in Roche to John & Elizabeth nee Johns. I always struggle with this surname (see 26th June 2012) and she was no exception. I can see her in censuses of 1861 with parents & sibs at Hillyvreath, Roche and St Stephen-in-Brannel respectively. On 5 Sep 1880 oddly in Kensal Green, London she married Thomas Richards from Madron.
They gave an address in Southam Street, but there is much online about how this was a slum area of Kensington, so they soon returned to Cornwall (maybe they eloped as he was still legally a minor). In 1881 census they were just married and shown living with her parents in St Stephens. Tom was a china-clay labourer and may well have worked with her brother Felix. (As you can see above, he had worked as a bricklayer in London, an end-product of clay-production). They were not in UK for 1891 census because they travelled across to USA that year and can be seen in Michigan in 1900 census there. Both her parents died in 1897 & 1899 and they went home in 1900, returning to USA with her sister Ellen to work with them as a servant. It may have been the deaths of her brothers Samuel and George which brought them back to England in 1902, and they can be seen back in Roche in 1911 census, Tom back to mining clay (he had mined iron in Michigan). He died aged 56 in 1916 and Alma 1924 aged 65. Tom was buried in an unconsecrated plot in Nanpean Cemetery, Alma in Roche, giving home address as Enniscaven, St Dennis.
Andrew Manhire, see 26th June 2012, nothing new
Ann Manhire was his sister, born 3 years after him, in 1860 in Illogan. Unfortunately she died aged 10 in Sep 1870 and was buried in Tuckingmill churchyard attached to All Saints church in that village
She had been recorded in 1861 census aged 1 at Brea, Roche with parents and siblings.
Monday 2nd December 2019
I am back, now to finish off the Knights before I move on to the next branch
William Alfred Knight, see 27th Feb 2017, nothing new
William James Knight, his uncle, see also 27th Feb 2017, also nothing new, although a man by his age and exact name was imprisoned in Sydney, Australia for stealing tools and sentenced to 6 months hard labour, I have no evidence that this was him. I see from his probate that he died at Higher Woodley, Lanivet, where he had been in 1939 Register. He left £19,365 but it is too recent to state to whom, but was probably his daughter Maud.
William James Leslie Bevill Knight, see 28th Feb 2017, seemed to have a collection of names he was known by, right up to his cremation:
(I have seen this property on Google Streetview, but cannot show you as it is a gated bungalow at the end of a residential street, largely hidden by trees)
William John Knight, see 17th June 2012 & 28th Feb 2017, where I followed him and his family via USA to Australia. I can now bring you a photograph of them all, taken in 1890 in Sydney:
back row: sons Nicholas, William & Anthony
middle row : daughter Susan, William and Elizabeth & daughter Louisa
front: son Joseph & daughter Elizabeth (Annie)
It's always nice to see photographs of the ancestors concerned.
William John Knight 2, see also 28th Feb 2017, I have now seen the baptism scan:
and noted his birth was on Christmas Day - must have been interesting! He died aged 14 and was buried in the Old Churchyard, Lanivet:
I just noticed this was Christmas too!
William Orinsa Knight, see same date, died aged 13:
sorry it's one of those blotty ones
William Roberts Knight, see same date, nothing new
William Udy Knight, see same date, I see from the scan that transcription of his marriage date was a month early
As you can see, it is very faint, but on close inspection I see it was dated 16 Jan 1826. Otherwise, nothing new.
Woodman Knight, see 7th Mar 2017, was baptised with his cousin Orlando:
No marriage or death scans, unfortunately
Tuesday 19th November 2019
William Knight 7, see 24th Feb 2017,I see he was baptised William Junior, but William Senior must have been his uncle, as both father and grandfather were Anthony. This was William 6 I featured yesterday.
The marriage was unusual, as I said in 2017, as Ann's first husband was not buried until 3 months later. Looking at the record, it was not on an official form, although the wording was copied by hand from one.
They may have been particularly keen to marry as Ann was by then 40 years old (13 years older than her husband). As it turned out, he died 8 years before her:
William Knight 8, see 26th Feb 2017, all details correct
No scan of burial I'm afraid, but it was in Majorca, Victoria, Australia.
William Knight 9, see 27th Feb 2017,
William Knight 10, see also 27th Feb 2017, where I lost him in his teens. Ancestry has suggested a marriage in Derbyshire, which I am happy with as it gives his father as John. Ann Elizabeth Wass was nee Boyce, born in Suffolk and another older wife, this time 12 years older than William
She was only married to John Wass for 4 years before he died aged 25 of smallpox, then 4 months later Ann lost her little daughter Kezia before she was even 2 years old, probably of the same condition. She married William 9 years later in her home town of Staveleys, Derbyshire and can be seen with him in 1881 census as a farm labourer in Chesterfield, Eckington 1891 & 1901 as horsekeeper at a colliery, along with 2 lodgers. In 1911 he was working for the railway as platelayer and they had moved to Whittington Moor (about 6 miles southwest). They may have remained there for the rest of his life, as his death was registered there in Newbold in 1923, then Ann's death was registered back in Chesterfield. Sorry, no scans.
I am going away now for a week, see you when I return.
Monday 18th November 2019
William Knight 4, Oliver's 5xgreat grandfather, see 24th Feb 2017, unfortuntely has no scan of baptism, although I do know when it occurred (see 2017 blog). I am glad to see the marriage record in such good condition, considering it is 325 years old!
Unfortunately the burial scans only start at 1731, so this is all, as he died aged only 38 in 1710.
William Knight 5, see also 24th Feb 2017, similarly nothing new as scans are not available for those years.
William Knight 6, see same date,
but no burial scan for him or his wife.
Wednesday 13th November 2019
Walter Cock Knight, see 20th Feb 2017, I still don't know why they waited until he was over 2 before baptising him:
His marriage was in USA, so I have to snip into 2 parts as there are so many columns:
I have seen his call-up papers for WW1, but as he was 45 years old and didn't enlist until Sep 1918, he may well have never seen service. After his death, Pearl can be seen in 1940 census, a widow aged 61, doing housework, with a live-in farmhand, and income from other sources. When she died, she was buried with Walter, for photo of gravestone see 2017 blog. There was an obituary in the local newspaper the Lancing State Journal, on 17th Apr 1967, but I cannot view it without paying a subscription, which I am loth to do. Oh by the way, I doscovered he had a grandson called Alden - the same as my son and extremely rare in this country (less so in USA where both he and my son live).
William Knight 1, see 16th Jun 2012 & 20th Feb 2017, scan of baptism:
and of marriage:
He died in New Zealand, so for photo of gravestone see 2017 blog.
William Knight 2, see 21st Feb 2017, where I gave a lot of detail, so can just bring you scans of baptism:
and first marriage:
(I showed his second marriage in 2017 blog). See 28th Oct 2012 & 17th Dec 2016 for his grave.
William Knight 3, see 21st Feb 2017, son of the above, as I said there are various "versions" which could be him, many of whom emigrated and I cannot prove any. His baptism must have been an interesting spectacle, as both babies were christened William Knight (the other one was William John, who I will cover at a later date) - the fathers were 3rd cousins, I believe.
However, this doesn't help me get any further with this William, as I have nothing to go on. William John was a bit of a globe-trotter, but I don't even know if they ever met again after the baptism.
Monday 11th November 2019
Thomas Oscar Knight, see 19th Feb 2017, nothing new.
Uriah Knight, see also 19th Feb, where I gave a lot of detail, so all I can bring you is scan of baptism:
and his first marriage:
and I did see a reference to the "rank" of Captain. It was in Kelly's Directory of 1889, referring to him as Captain of Clay Works, Virginia, St Stephens.
Sunday 10th November 2019
Thomas Knight 2, son of Thomas 1 below, Oliver's great great-uncle, see 18th Feb 2017. Scans:
(I love the economical way the register for Luxulyan baptisms & burials was kept, baptisms one way and burials the other)
Thomas Knight 3 was his son, see also 18th Feb 2017, first "attempt":
unfortunately not a burial scan of this guy
Thomas Knight 4, see 18th Feb 2017, Oliver's 4xgreat uncle, but I still only know his baptism:
as there is no sign of him after this.
Thomas Knight 5, see also 18th Feb 2017, baptism scan:
I suspect (although cannot prove it) he is the Thomas Knight, sergeant & carpenter, who was a Chelsea Pensioner in the Royal Engineers, discharged with a pension in 1867. He was born in Lostwithiel in 1828, so fits the details. However, he could have gone anywhere on discharge and may be the one buried in Ewell, Surrye on 13 Nov 1871 aged 43.
There was another one; I should call him Thomas Knight 6, I haven't mentioned him before as he died aged 7. He was born in St Stephen in Brannel in the January quarter of 1857 to John & Amy nee Rowe. It appears that he was not baptised; John & Amy did not do this for their children. So all I can bring you is his burial scan. He died in Jan 1864 and was buried in St Stephens on 17 Jan. Oh, he did appear in the 1861 census aged 4 with parents and sibs at Bloomdale, St Stephens.
Saturday 9th November 2019
Susan Knight, see 4th Jun 2012 & 14th Feb 2017, nothing new and no scans.
Susan Jane Knight, see same dates, scans:
Next is Jessie's grandmother Tahpenes Knight, see 17th Feb 2017, the only new thing I can bring you is scan of marriage:
Thomas Knight 1, see 4th June 2012 & 18th Feb 2017, Oliver's great great grandfather. Scans:
As I said in 2017, I was puzzled by Elizabeth's death. I have looked in the burial book above, and cannot find her. I was concerned she may be Betsy or Liz etc but no sign of these either. I also searched the newspapers of 1814 for anything on the story, to no avail.
Tuesday 5th November 2019
Sarah Knight 1, see 11th Feb 2017, nothing new, unless she was buried on 5Jan 1794 at St Dennis. I cannot confirm this as no age was given (she would be 39).
Sarah Knight 2, see also 11th Feb 2017, baptised as Sally:
married as Sarah:
1841 census was as Sally, 1851 as Sarah, then her death was registered in Jan 1856 as Sally, but there is no scan that I can see.
Sarah Ann Knight, see also 11th Feb 2017, (the lady who married Butch Cassidy lol).
Sarah Ann died 23 Jan 1938 and joined her husband in the grave at Roche, where he had been for 6 years. For photograph of the stone see 2017 blog.
Simon Knight, see 2nd June 2012 & 14th Feb 2017
Grace died in1883:
Simon married Fanny Brokenshire at St Columb on 29 Mar 1884, but there doesn't seem to be a scan. This is a shame, as the transcription claims to say they were in their 20s, not their 60s. Anyway, as I said in 2012, she lived with her step-daughter Mary Jane at "Margate", Bodmin until her death in 1905, leaving £780 to her at her death. As you can see, Simon was buried with Grace and son David. I understand Fanny was buried in Treverbyn, so I should have a photo of her grave somewhere...
Saturday 2nd November 2019
Robins and Roberts tended to get muddled in the past, when most ordinary folk were illiterate, so I apologise if I have muddled these guys.
Robin Knight 1, see 7th Feb 2017, when I called him "Robin Senior", was Oliver's 4xgreat uncle. He was the one who maried Mary Robbins and was possibly the father of Robert 1, studied on Wednesday.
(as you can see, both bride and groom "made their mark")
They had 5 children, although the first Mary died aged 2, Mary herself then died in 1895 aged 40 and was buried on 23 June in Luxulyan. Robin lived on for a further 34 years and when he was buried on 5 Mar 1829 his home address was given as Bodmin Asylum. I can find no more details.
Robin Knight 2, see also 7th Feb 2017, ostensibly his son. Whether Robert or Robin he married Eleanor Kite of Liskeard on 15 Sep 1794 but I cannot find a scan. Eleanor died aged 55 at St Stephen in Brannel and was buried 25 Apr 1825
13 years later Rob died at St Stephen and joined her on 5 Nov 1838
Robin Knight 3, who I have never mentioned due to lack of information, was born around Christmas 1773 to Joseph & Elizabeth nee Mark in Roche and baptised there on 3 Jan 1774
I can't see any more; I see his mother died when he was 10 and his father re-married but they remained in Roche and I can't see a marriage or burial there that fits.
Rosa Mary Knight, see 8th May 2012 & 7th Feb 2017. This story is interesting as it links two branches of the tree.
As I told in 2012, Rosa and Joseph were distant relatives; his mother was Betsey Knight who married Joseph Trudeon, and their grandfathers were cousins. I suppose this kind of thing happened a lot in the emigrating families in a distant land (and no doubt even closer relatives intermarried). Joseph emigrated after the death of two sisters in 1871, and married Josephia Haydon, also from Luxulyan, 2 years later. She died in 1890 and Joseph married Rosa at the end of that year:
She had probably emigrated in 1888 after the death of her father.After giving him 6 sons, she died aged 38 and was buried at Jordan Cemetery. Emma Trethewey from St Issey in Cornwall, travelled out to join and marry Joseph the following year, then he died in 1917 and she in 1926.
Wednesday 30th October 2019
Robert Knight 1, see 22nd Oct 2012 & 6th Feb 2017, Oliver's great grandfather. I have a dilemma here: his baptism appears to relate to a duplicate Robin/Robert (the name appeared to be interchangeable) born in the same year but who married a different lady and produced a different family. I had taken them to be brothers/twins but there is only one mentioned on the baptism scan
The more I look into this the more confusing it gets. I shall just hold off the assumption that Robert and Mary were parents of this guy; I know his connections down the tree. Again there is no scan for his marriage to Betsy Udy but the OPC site has 3 versions of it, so I know it is correct. The same applies to his burial.
Robert Knight 2, see 28th May 2012 & 6th Feb 2017, son of the Robert who married Eleanor Kite. Scans:
And in 1838 they emigrated to Australia, had 5 more children and Robert died aged 49 in 1855: burial card from Botany Bay Cemetery
Elizabeth moved in with her son Lancelot and died in 1872 after a long illness with liver cancer aged 61.
An unfortunate aside is shown in this clipping from the New South Wales Police Gazette of 1864, showing that they were trying to find Robert and Elizabeth, 9 years after his death. I don't know who had died, as his father died only weeks after they left England. I also don't know if Elizabeth got this information.
Robert Knight 3, Oliver's grandfather, see 6th Feb 2017, scans:
Lavinia died in 1905 at the Asylum, as I stated, then Robert 4 years later at the Station. They were buried at Treverbyn:
Robert Knight 4, see 7th Feb 2017, their son and thus Oliver's uncle. But there is nothing new.
Monday 28th October 2019
Richard Knight 2, see 26th May 2012 & 6th Feb 2017, seems not to have been baptised, but then I cannot locate the marriage either in the form of a scan or on OPC website. The only new record is details of the grave:
Wording says: "In loving memory of Richard, dearly beloved husband of Emily Knight. Died at Whitemoor Jan 21 1923 aged 68 years. Until the Day Break and the Shadows Flee Away. Also Emily, his beloved wife, Died at Whitemoor Mar 31 1944 aged 82 years. Ever Remembered by All" She sent Obituaries to the Western Morning News, and possibly some others, but I cannot access scans, so the above will have to suffice. She lived at Whitemoor for another21 years until she died there, then joined him in the grave above.
Saturday 26th October 2019
Prudence Knight, see 21st May 2012 & 5th Feb 2017, her baptism scan shows birth date of 31 Jul 1856 and baptism took place at the Lanivet Wesleyan Chapel on 30 Sep 1856
It is an unusual name, so I was tempted to believe she was imprisoned in 1870 for receiving stolen goods from one Mary Jane Knight, servant indicted for larceny. If you look at my entry for Mary Jane on 14th OCtober below, she disappeared for years, so this may be the explanation. However, there is so little detail - merely names - that I cannot state this as fact. My tendency is to believe this was Mrs Prudence Knight, wife of William, Redruth blacksmith, as there was a Mary Jane Knight in her household, her daughter. This makes more sense than passing stolen goods to a 14-year-old. So, the next we see is her death at 16:
Rebecca Knight, Oliver's great great-aunt, see same dates, no scan for baptism but marriage:
(witnesses included her siblings James & Eden). Also no scan of her burial, which took place at the Innis Chapel on 29 Jan 1879.
Reginald Woodman Knight, see 5th Feb 2017, nothing new
Renee Gwendoline Knight, see also 5th Feb 2017, nothing new
Reuben Knight was not discussed before, as he died aged 2, but has 2 new records. He was born and died at Colbiggan, Roche and baptised at Roche on 27 Jun 1833:
Richard Knight 1, see 26th May 2012 & 6th Feb 2017, born 1832 to Anthony & Philippa, has a full set of scans:
Mary Ann's burial
Wednesday 23rd October 2019
Philip Knight 4, see 3rd Feb 2017, baptism scan:
However, I still cannot really confirm the marriage. FamilySearch, who hold the scans, deny online access for some, stating we have to attend a Family History Centre (run by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latterday Saints) to see them. My nearest is apparently in Stevenage and only open once a week. Much though I admire them for their diligence, I have no wish to attend a church, so will leave it here (I thought I owed you an explanation). Burial scans:
As I said in 2017, he died in the Workhouse, maybe because of poverty maybe for medical treatment. All his children were unavailable to look after him.
Philip Orlando Knight, see 3rd Feb 2017, baprism scan:
but there is no more: although I see the passenger list showing his return in 1895 I still cannot locate a death.
Philippa Knight, see 4th Feb 2017, where I told the whole story. Scans:
Tuesday 22nd October 2019
Percy Kngdon Knight, see 31st Jan 2017, nothing new. There was a red herring, who travelled to New York in 1948 but turned out to have a wife & daughter ours didn't, and came from Leeds.
Philip Knight 1, see 31st Jan 2017, Oliver's great grandfather, scans:
His probate showed he left effects worth less than £100 to his widow Betsey
Philip Knight 2, see same date, son of the above, scans:
Philip Knight 3, see 3rd February 2017, Oliver's uncle. It looks as if he wasn't baptised, so just burial scan:
Monday 21st October 2019
Oretta Knight, see 31st Jan 2017, Oliver's aunt, there are no new records even in the form of scans, unfortunately. See previous entry for grave photo.
Oscar Orlando Knight (Oscarlando), see 19th May 2012 & 31st Jan 2017, the only new record is baptism scan:
Paul Knight 1, see 20th May 2012 & 31st Jan 2017, only new document is burial scan:
Paul Knight 2, see same dates, scans:
(with his father, who was buried 11 days after him, as you can see)
Sunday 20th October 2019
Nicholas Knight 2, see 27th Jan 2017, son of 1 above, 2017 account has much detail but new records:
(I had to cut it up as American record books are wide)
Nicholas Knight 3, see 30th Jan 2017, who died aged 3, there is a baptism scan:
but unfortunately not one for burial
Nicholas Roach Knight, see also 30th Jan 2017, a detailed account and again emigration to USA.
He was buried at Wheat Ridge Cemetery, Jefferson County, Colorado, photo in 2017 blog.
Wednesday 16th October 2019
Nancy Ann Knight, see 16th May 2012, scan of baptism:
It took a while to find her first marriage scan, and when I did I could see why there had been problems transcribing it; they didn't seem to know what name to put for the bride; she was named as Nany twice then settled on Ann and that was what she signed. Witnesses were her brother Anthony and a John Rowe:
Marriage was by licence as she wasn't 21 until the following February, but she was already expecting, so time was of the essence. Unfortunately, as I reported before, they lost the child at the age of 2 (of croup), by which time her husband had died too (of fever):
(only a few pages on in the same register)
I stated how they had 7 children, then when daughter Sarah died in 1869 they emigrated to USA. I have now seen the passenger list, and the family left England at the end of 1867. Also, Sarah Jane may have married rather than died, but I won't investigate as she is 3rd cousin 2x removed, and thus somewhat obscure. The passenger list of the "Tarifin", sailing from Liverpool and landing at New York on 5 Nov 1867 included Thomas & Nancy, Thomas jr and his wife Anna, also daughter Jenifer and an infant Sarah Ann Jane (probably illegitimate daughter of Jenifer and possibly the reason for the move). No records are new.
Nicholas Knight 1, see 27th Jan 2017, another story ending with emigration to US. New records show that he became a china-clay Agent from 1883 (Kelly's Directory)
Tuesday 15th October 2019
Milda Knight (Ludgamilda), see 24th Jan 2017, baptism scan:
I cannot find anything further on her.
Muriel Ellen Knight, see 27th Jan 2017, she married Leslie Leeds Paine in Jul 1940 in Surrey, where I have found him living with his mother in 1939 electoral roll in Wracclesham, Farnham, Surrey. Likewise they (Muriel & Leslie) can be seen in 1953 & 1955 at Barry Cottage, Bat & Ball Lane, Farnham. When he died in 1986 he was buried in St Peter's Cemetery, Wracclesham and Muriel moved 60 miles, across to West Oxfordshire, and died 3 years later.
Monday 14th October 2019
There was one more Mary Ann Knight, 6 I suppose, born to William Knight & Kitty nee Roach in Jul 1848, who I did not report on, it seems. She was baptised on 4 Dec 1848 by the Bible Christian Church in Luxulyan
She can be seen in censuses of 1851 & 1861 at Tresibble with paents and sibs. Then on 18 May 1868 she emigrated to USA aged 20, aboard the "City of Paris". After that I cannot tell which of three with her name & year/country of birth is her.
Mary Jane Knight, see 24th Jan 2017, where I disproved my story up to then. and this hasn't left much. She can be seen in censuses of 1851 & 1861 with parents & sibs at Polpinka, Menheniot but by 1871 she has left home. She may have emigrated, as Mary Jane above, or married, but I cannot match up either. If not, there is a death at the correct age in Apr 1899 under her maiden name, at Goonhaven, burial at Perranzabuloe on 16 May, but where was she inthe intervening censuses of 1871-91?
Matthew Knight, born to Robin/Robert & Mary nee Robbins, baptised 29 Oct 1777 was all that I knew:
I see now that he may have married a Mary Harris from St Columb in 1817, witnesses George HArris and William Sleeman. The latter also got married in st Columb 3 years later, with Matthew as a witness, to an Ann Knight, so may be related. There were two "versions", owning freeholds of houses in St Columb in 1851 & 1852, but these both died in 1853 & 1863, with incorrect ages. A third Matthew died 16 Mar 1797 in Luxulyan. All rather inconclusive, I'm afraid.
Saturday 12th October 2019
Mary Ann Knight 2, see 15th May 2012 & 23rd Jan 2017, scan of baptism:
Mary Ann Knight 3, see same dates, scans of baptism:
Mary Ann Knight 4, see same dates, scans of marriage:
(they obviously had no blotting paper)
Mary Ann Knight 5, see 23rd Jan 2017, baptism scan:
that of marriage
and burial of her husband Peter.
I thought I had found her burial on 12 Apr 1860, but when I saw the scan realised it was not her. This lady was aged 45 and was staying at the Commercial Inn, "a stranger". Our Mary Ann would have been 68 and no doubt still resident in Roche. I can't be sure about her if this is not her death, she may even have gone to Australia to son Henry. The other possibility, buried in Jan 1861, turned out to be a 2-year-old.
Thursday 10th October 2019
Mary Knight 4, Oliver's 5xgreat-aunt, see 22nd Jan 2017, baptism scan:
No scan of marriage, I'm afraid, but her burial:
Mary Knight 5, see 23rd Jan 2017, baptised in Roche on 3 Jul 1783:
I hadn't noticed that her mother died less than 3 weeks later and was buried on 21 Jul in Roche, probably due to complications with the birth. She was 41. Joseph never stopped having children, so Mary grew up as one of 16! She married at 20 and had 13 of her own. She was buried at St Dennis on 8 May 1860:
There are a few more Marys I have not dealt with here, but not much known on them.
Mary Knight 6, Oliver's 4xgreat-aunt, born to John Knight & Dorothy nee Bray, baptised 2 Nov 1726 and buried 2 days later, both in Roche
Mary Knight 7 & 8 were born to Robin/Robert Knight & Mary nee Robbins, 7:
baptized 7 Jun 1779, buried 20 Jan 1782
baptised 28 Sep 1783 but I cannot find her after this.
Mary Ann Knight 1, see 11th May 2012 & 23rd Jan 2017, but her baptism was mis-transcribed; you can see why:
I can now see she was baptised at a month or so old, rather than aged 4.
Wednesday 9th October 2019
Lucretia Elsie Ashton Knight, see 1st May 2012 & 20th Jan 2017, where much detail was given, as there is nothing new apart from the fact that she was cremated on 14 Aug 1962 at Kent & Sussex Crematorium, Tonbridge. See sister Kate last Saturday.
Lucy Beatrice Knight, see same dates, where I told the whole story, including 2 attempts at divorce. There is nothing new.
Mabel Knight, sister of the above, see same account. What's new is her death certificate, stating she died of pneumonia she had suffered from for 2 days
Maria Knight, see 20th Jan 2017. Streetview still han't been updated, so no help there with Drinnick. I can bring you a scan of her marriage, although it is one where they were in need of blotting paper:
Mary Knight 1, see 7th May 2012 & 22nd Jan 2017, baptism scan:
nothing else new except scan of daughter's marriage, which I will not include here.
Mary Knight 2, see 8th May 2012, difficult as she was last seen in 1891 in Devon, working as a cook, and her parents both died in 1896.
Mary Knight 3, see also 8th May 2012, nothing new, I'm afraid
Sunday 6th October 2019
Lavinia Knight, see 29th Apr 2012 & 17th Jan 2017, Jessie's great-aunt. New records include a passenger list showing George & Lavinia leaving Southampton to go to New York, visiting their daughter Maude, no doubt. 5 years later Lavinia went with daughter Eva, as I said in 2017. The other is a scan of their marriage:
Lavinia Jane Knight, see 28th Apr 2012.New records are a trip to New York with her husband and 3 children on 10 Sep 1890, which may explain where they were for the census the following year, although they were in West Ham in 1892 for birth of Florence. Also her burial on 9 Feb 1895 in Walthamstow Cemetery, Queens Road
This document says she died at 50 Somers Road, Walthamstow, just a couple of streets from the cemetery
Lezzette Munro Knight, see 17th Jan 2017, burial scan:
Louisa Knight 1, see 20th Jan 2017, was ever confusing, and now even more so. I can see a birth in Cheshire in her name with mother's maiden-name Bennett, and another in Durham with the same, but she and her family never moved from Cornwall.
Louisa Knight 2, see 1st May 2012 & 20th Jan 2017. There is no scan of her baptism but I now know it took place on 28 Jul 1868, when she was 3 months old, at Zoar Chapel, Roche, the Strict Baptist chapel.
Saturday 5th October 2019
OK, that was fun, firstly our son came over from USA with his family, then we all went across to Norway to stay with our daughter. Now I must get back to this.
Kate Knight, see 17th Jan 2017, updates include 1939 Register (no change) and a cremation record. On 26 Jan 1968 she was cremated at Kent & Sussex Crematorium, "Royal Tunbridge Wells" in the name of Kathleen Knight.
Kitty Knight, for which I only have a birth, baptism & 1841 census, was matched up by Ancestry hints with death in 1893, but with nothing between I cannot accept this and have to believe the one in 1853 aged "35". I have said before that death ages can be way off, and maybe she was so ill that she looked 6 years older... In this case she was born to Joseph jr and Betsey Merrifield, baptised on 12 Dec 1824 and was buried on 27 Aug 1853, both in Roche. Unfortunately, Christiana Knight, born 5 years before, was also known as Kitty and has confused matters.
Sunday 28th September 2019
Just popping in to say I have been away and will be so for another week. See you on 5th October
Monday 9th September 2019
Continuing the story of Joseph6 and Priscilla, and their son Joseph Henry Hocken Knight, see 23rd Apr 2012 & 14th Jan 2017, where I told his story in a somewhat fragmented way. I didn't mention his baptism but knew there must be one, his father being so prevalent in the Bible Christian Church. I was correct, he was baptised by the Bible Christian Church at Ebenezer Chapel in Luxulyan on Christmas Day 1851.
my photo 2009
As I said in 2012, he was only a child when his father died and he went to live with his uncle William. However, when things were sorted out he returned to his mother at Rock Cottage and they ran the family business from there. In 1875 he married for the first time:
Emma died in 1911, when they had moved to Devon and settled down in the Refreshment House/Hotel. He remarried in Oct 1912, to Agnes Groves, who I think was a Devonshire lass in her 50s, thus no children. I'm afraid there are no scans of Devon marriages on FamilySearch, Similarly when he died on 14 Dec 1918 there is no burial scan, but I have already brought you his obituary and probate details. The hotel was being run by his daughters Priscilla and Minnie in 1911, so by 1939 Register (when Agnes had died) Minnie and her husband were running it, with Priscilla "retired hotel proprietor" as a resident. Son Harry was a married Meter Maker, living in Exeter with wife and invalid son and other daughter Evelyn likewise married to an "Insurance Supervisor" and living in Exeter.
This is the site of the hotel, where it says London Inn Square just above the middle, at the bottom of Northernhay Place. This was a road leading round the castle to Northernhay House, which was demolished in 1914, due to not being in a fit state for use as a hospital in wartime, which had been the plan. (One of the modern buildings on the site is now a student Hall of Residence by the same name.) The Hotel was at the end of this terrace:
in 1911 it was number 9, empty in 1939 and now gone, as you can see (block only goes to number 6) but at the rear is a restaurant which seems to have taken its place. Conveniently called "Circa 1924" it tells me when it sprang up out of Joseph's legacy.
Josiah W Knight, see 15th Jan 2017, had an interesting life, including the accidental shooting of his son. Starting at the beginning, I now have a scan of the baptism:
As this occurred "at their home" I had assumed Higher Menedew, but of course 1851 census showed the family at an address called "Croft, Luxulyan", very near to Innis, and they weren't at Menedew until the 1861 census. George Ruffin, who baptised him, would have been the minister who came out from Innis Chapel to perform the ceremony. As I said, he inherited the farm and lived at Menadew all his life. Unfortunately I cannot track down scans of his marriage or burial.
Joyce Knight, see 15th Jan 2017, baptism scan:
(I hope you can read it: it says "Sept 19th was baptised Joyce daur of John & Joyce Knight")
At her marriage, both bride & groom "made their mark" as they could not read/write, so neither notice the mis-spelling of Joyce's name as "Joise Knigh"
She died aged 69 in 1839 and was buried on 9 Jan in Roche, having lived all her life there. Edward died there too 10 years later.
Sunday 8th September 2019
Joseph Knight 5 (Junior), see 24th Apr & 13th Jan 2017, son of Joseph 4 and Elizabeth (see Friday)
I can't find a scan of the marriage but am assured that it took place on 14 Jan 1817 in St Wenn, bride's hometown. He was buried on 8 Nov 1870 at Roche
and it seems that Betsy spent her final years in the Workhouse, as her burial record gives that as her address:
I have mentioned before that sometimes, in years prior to the formation of the NHS in 1948, the only way people could get medical treatment, particularly in childbirth or death, and this may have been the case here, as they had plenty of children to take her in. Incidentally, I noticed that the next name on the burial register (and from the same place) was the same as her step-mother-in-law Mary Pappin. This was almost a century later, so I don't know if they were related.
Joseph Knight 6, see 23rd Apr & 21st Oct 2012 and 13th Jan 2017, the Bible Christian lay preacher, Oliver's great great uncle. Scans:
No scan of marriage, unfortunately, although I know it took place between him and Priscilla Hocken in Apr 1845 at Michaelstow, Camelford, where she had been baptised
When he died, as he was a devout Bible Christian, he was buried at Innis Chapel, leaving effects to Priscilla, and she continued to live at Higher Menedew, as he owned the Freehold
After his death, Priscilla can be seen in 1861 still at Menedew, listed as "retired farmer's widow", aged 50, alone with a servant or the same age. By 1861 she had moved to Rock Cottage, with all three "children", running a Manure & Coal Merchants business.
See 3rd Sep below for her son John Hocken Knight, with whom she moved by 1881 to Fore Street, St Blazey and can be seen there in 1881 and 1891 censuses with him and his family. She was still there in 1893, when she died and was buried at Luxulyan:
Joseph Knight 7, see 26th Apr 2012 & 14th Jan 2017, baptism scan throws up an address that puzzles transcribers:
Even the locals working for the Cornwall OPC site have transcribed this as "Lea-?" and I'm not even sure of that. Anyway, he must have been baptised at St Clement's. Marriage scans:
14 Feb 1857
24 Nov 1860
Nothing more, though, as all the names are far too common.
There was another "plain" Joseph Knight, I suppose he should be no. 8. He was born in Oct 1866 to Simon & Grace, at Polpinka, Menheniot and baptised privately there on 25 Jan 1867 aged 4 months (I don't have a scan). This was evidently due to the fact that he was ill and was followed immediately by a burial on 1 Feb also at Menheniot
There was a Joe Knight , son of Joseph and Jane, baptised as such on 19 Oct 1789
but died aged 4 and was buried 2 Sep 1793
Friday 6th September 2019
Joseph Knight 2, see 24th Apr 2012, I have a bit more information now:
This scan shows the address at the time of baptism (and thus possibly where he was born) was Tresibble Common, to the south of Criggan Common.
(witnessed by two of Jane's brothers - she had plenty! - although both bride and groom "made their mark")
confirms he left his effects to brother David, as I postulated in 2012. The OPC site has a transcription of his burial, showing his residence as Slades, St Austell. This was not a farm then, it may have been a nursing home. He was buried in the council cemetery at Roche
(sorry, I have tried to rotate this, but it is stubborn) Inscription says "In Memory of Joseph Knight of Criggan in this parish who died at Slades, St Austell, August 12th 1901 aged 79 years and of Jane his wife who died June 7th in the same year aged 73"
Joseph Knight 3 (Senior), see 24th Apr 2012 & 13th Jan 2017, Oliver's 4xgreat uncle. Scans:
Joseph Knight 4, see 24th Apr 2012 & 12th Jan 2017, eldest son of 3 above and thus known generally as Junior. He was not the one baptised Joe - see later.
There is not a scan for his baptism, which took place at Roche on 12 Jun 1763, but when I located his marriage document I made a discovery
As you can see, when he married Elizabeth Williams in 1788 he was already a widower!. I have now found he married Mary Pappin on 14 Oct 1782 in St Austell, aged 19 and she died 5 years later at the age of 26. They had by then produced one daughter Mary, born 1785. The first marriage:
and Mary's burial
Elizabeth's burial was at St Austell on 6 Dec 1793, and as you can see from the scan, she was one of the "first in the new ground"
In 1793, the government approved a new burial ground in High Cross Street. Land described as “High Cross Field and Enclosure” was purchased from William Flamank for £38-17s. Flamank also received three fields known locally as Polkeys (presumably Polkyth) from the Parish Council in exchange for the High Cross Field. At this stage only the area already enclosed by a stone wall was to be used for burials while the rest of the land was to be used as a “public fair place”.
By the time Joseph died in 1837 he was living at Woon, and was buried on 12 April in Roche
Tuesday 3rd September 2019
John Knight 13, mentioned yesterday, had a baptism scan in 1781 I forgot to attach:
John Knight 14 also had a short life. He was born in August 1849 at Polpinka, Menheniot to Simon & Grace nee Bennett and they had a private baptism ceremony on 25 November that year
and he died shortly afterwards, buried on 14 Dec 1849. Unfortunately the Menheniot records on FamilySearch (source of scans of Parish Records) starts on 1st Jan 1850, just a few days later!
John Common Knight, see 12th Feb 2015, a very detailed account so not much to add. Just a death certificate scan:
John Gerald Ashton Knight (Jack), see 12th Feb 2015, no scans, just birth registration in Bodmin in Aug 1891 and death in Tonbridge, Kent in Sep 1916
John Henry Knight, see12th Feb 2015, no baptism, so no scan for that. He didn't marry, so all I hoped for was at his death. The scenario is a little unclear there though. He was last seen in 1901 living with his mother at Nanpean, but she died in 1908 at Whitemoor. This is just a mile from Nanpean, and the burial record I have for him is a mile in another direction, at St Dennis on 14 Mar 1911, home address Well Lane, which doesn't seem to exist any more.
John Hocken Knight, see 13th Feb 2015 & 10th Jan 2017, the clay works manager. He was baptised at Ebenezer Chapel, Luxulyan on 23 Aug 1846 - by John Knight!
(sorry I had to split the entry in half).
I gave plenty of detail re his burial but appear not to have included a photo of his memorial. I know I took one, but still cannot find it, so here is one I downloaded from Ancestry:
Unfortunately this one is rather dark. The inscription says "In loving memory of John Hocken devoted husband of Elizabeth Jane Knight of Priory Mead who died December 30th 1927 also Elizabeth Jane wife of the above who died November 14th 1934".
John Roberts Knight, see 13th Feb 2015, nothing new, including the 1948 burial of his wife Louisa. Her death was registered in the October quarter of that year in Stratton, Cornwall, but no burial record as yet.
Joseph Knight 1, see 10th Jan 2017, also 24th Apr 2012. Littlejohns was a pit near St Stephen in Brannel, which maybe was why he and his father were baptised in Roche, as I discussed in 2012, as there may not have been a church nearby.
(incidentally, this volume of parish records started in the New Year 1813 and the first three entries were all Knights! This is the earliest in Roche held by FamilySearch, although some go back to 1538, I understand, and the OPC site has transcriptions of records they hold dating from 1571)
As they were both from miners' families, it isn't surprising that both bride and groom "made their mark", rather than signed, as did Mary Kellow, one of the witnesses (possibly sister of the bride, her mother had died 2 years before).
Burials at St Cleer were listed on a typed list, unusually:
and Frances joined him in the same cemetery in 1881
Monday 2nd September 2019
John Knight 11, see 9th Feb 2015, scans:
baptism, showing home address as Venton Vale, Roche. I cannot locate this, so may have related to a mine etc no longer in existence.
(unfortunately this is one record that would have benefitted from blotting-paper! If you cannot see the details: groom from Kernick signed, bride from Nanpean marked, bride's father Thomas Rowe was blacksmith, groom's father Thomas Knight yeoman. Witnesses were Philomena Rowe & Absalom Hore)
I gave details of death and burial in 2015.
John Knight 12, also see 9th Feb 2015, scans:
no scan of marriage I am afraid
(burial records for him and wife Charlotte are so close as to be on the same page of the register of grave spaces)
It was the probate document giving his date of death a week after his burial, and was a simple typo, probably should read 17 Dec 1896, or maybe even 7 Dec.
There is another John Knight born 1781 to Robin & Mary, but as all I have to go on is 1841 census where the ages are all approximated I hesitate to include him. He seems to have married a Sarah, but I cannot rind a record to match.
Friday 28th August 2019
John Knight 7, see 8th Feb 2015 & 10th Jan 2017, a full set of scans:
of course Elizabeth died in 1806
John Knight 8, see 8th Feb 2015, now I have seen his baptism scan I see that he was actually born in June 1808 and baptised on Christmas Day aged 6 months:
At their marriage in 1826 the bride "made her mark" but John had a go at signing the register. He evidently wasn't used to it and made a big blot with the ink - most of our guys were labourers etc
After emigration to Australia, I lose track of him, and still cannot track down his death record
John Knight 9, see 8th Feb 2915, I have scans:
but when it came to his burial, I had a shock - there was another Knight buried on that day! It turned out to be his little grandson Charles Edward Knight, who died aged 6 months. In the local newspaper there was a mention of John's demise, but not of his grandson, whose death may have just been a coincidence
John Knight 10, see 8th Feb 2015, scans:
The Annears were a familar local family, Melinda had been baptised in the Wesleyan faith 10 years after John:
When John died aged 58 in 1871 he was buried in St Gomonda's churchyard and this stone erected, on which was a mention of two sons John and Albert who had died in infancy a few years before (for my photo of the stone, see 2015 blog). Melinda remarried and died in 1885 under the surname Grose.
Tuesday 27th August 2019
John Knight 4, see 7th Feb 2015 & 10th Jan 2017, scans:
and that of Grace his wife
but no new facts.
John Knight 5, see 7th Feb 2015, Oliver's great great-uncle,
(I just noticed the date was not completed on this, but it stood, there's no doubt)
Mary Ann died 10 years earlier and was buried in the same place, Roche, but I can't locate a scan.
Their son John Knight 6, see 7th Feb 2015, I was hoping to find his emigration on the Cornwall OPC site, but the only one was for a 13-year-old, and he was in his 30s with several children by then. Actually the children's place of birth tells us they left in 1842, as Susan was born in Canada.
Saturday 24th August 2019
Jenefer Knight, see 6th Feb 2015 & 9th Jan 2017,
(I hope you can read this bad scan. It says "Jenefer and Ann twin daughters of Robert and Betsy Knight June 19th")
Marriage scan is difficult too:
and I cannot track down a scan of her burial in 1869, just her husband's the previous year:
Jenepher Knight, see same dates, scans:
I had difficulty with their deaths. As I said before, it seems they both died in the same quarter, Jul 1901, not long after the census, so we knew where they lived; Station Road, St. Blazey. However, the ages didn't match up on the burials I found and when I found John's probate, nothing tallied at all. So...
...On to the Johns.
John Knight 1, see 7th Feb 2015 & 10th Jan 2017, which is very difficult due to being so early. I have been unable to confirm Family Finders' information on his birth as Cornwall OPC don't have a John Knight born around that time. What I have found is an entry on a list of banns read in Bradoc (Broadoak) for him and Elizabeth, made from the Parish Registers
Apparently she died the following year, having son John, who also died in the process, but I cannot find her death record. He apparently survived long enough to be baptised on 10 May 1670 but died 6 months later and I cannot find a scan of his burial, although know he was interred at Braddock on 6 Nov 1670. The second marriage (ostensibly in Nottingham) and subsequent son William, sent to me by Family Finders, I cannot find any confirmation, so it is tempting to disregard it, but for the fact that we are descended from his son John2. Finally, I do have a scan of John1's burial record:
Roche Parish Records
The grandson I mentioned above, John Knight 2, see 7th Feb 2015, was responsible for the huge size of this tree, having 11 children! I have fortunately now got a full set of scans to bring you:
and that of his wife Dorothy in 1767:
John Knight 3, his son, see also 7th Feb 2015, Oliver's 3xg grandfather. I hadn't noticed before, but Joyce's mother had the most wonderful maiden-name; she was Rebecca Templeria before she became Mrs Williams. I have scans for him:
Now, as I said in 2015, I was told by another genealogist that he died in Feb 1800. However, the only burial record I can find is in the wrong place and 3 months later. I have a scan of Joyce's burial in 1790:
Friday 23rd August 2019
James Knight 11, see 2nd Feb 2015 & 8th Jan 2017, nothing new except scans:
Two other Jameses yielded little: One baptised on 16 Nov 1768 in Roche by parents Joseph & Elizabeth nee Mark may have been the one who died in Redruth in 1837, but I have no way of telling, as there was minimal information on both documents. The other one died aged 2, but I do now have a scan of the burial entry in Roche:
James Helman Knight, see 8th Jan 2017, nothing new
Jane Knight 1, see 2nd Feb 2015, scans:
(Cornish OPC site tells that the ceremony took placeon 7 June 1813 in St Austell, witnessed by Joseph Knight - probably her father but could be her brother - and Luke Thomas). Deaths were complicated - the one I thought was hers in 1861 turned out to be for a 47-year-old and she was 68, and the one in 1869 was a 16-year-old when she was 76. The remaining date is Apr 1864, but the record has no age that I can use. William, however, has a burial scan:
although I still cannot locate him in 1871 census. He may well be already in the Workhouse with an error in name/age etc.
Jane Knight 2, see 2nd Feb 2015, a very detailed account, the only new detail I can add was his war pension, dating from 13 Nov 1868, adjusted to widow's on 21 Apr 1892 (3 days after he died).
Jane Knight 3, see 3rd Feb 2015 & 9th Jan 2017, scans:
and the OPC site informs that the ceremony took place on 16 Oct, witnessed by John Darnell & John Rowe.
Jane Knight 4, see 5th Feb 2015 (ignore 2017, I had a mix-up) her burial scan
and that of husband John
Jane Knight 5 wasn't mentioned before because all I knew was she was born 1827 to Anthony & Ann nee Jeffery then died aged almost two in 1828 and was buried 9 Dec in Roche.
Jane Merrifield Knight, see 5th Feb 2015, scans:
Tuesday 20th August 2019
Hilda Clarice Knight, see 30th Jan 2015 & 8th Jan 2017, nothing new
On to the huge bunch of Jameses
James Knight 1, see 30th Jan 2015 & 8th Jan 2017, the only new record is scan of burial document:
otherwise it is still a matter of removing red herrings, i.e. the lives of others by the same name in USA and Australia.
James Knight 2, see same dates, nothing new
James Knight 3, see 31st Jan 2015, nothing new
James Knight 4, see 31st Jan also, new scan of marriage:
James Knight 5, see 1st Feb 2015, scans:
James Knight 6, see 1st Feb 2015, new information is that witnesses at the marriage were Philip (probably an uncle named after bride's grandfather) & James Robins, bride signed, groom "made his mark" and both were "of this parish".
James was buried 13 Feb 1805 in Roche, then Blanche 1831:
(James' scan was in earlier folder and wouldn't load.)
James Knight 7, see 1st Feb 2015 & 8th Jan 2017, son of James 6 and Blanche, burial scan 1838:
and Philippa followed in 1842:
James Knight 8, his son, see same dates, further information on burials is that James was interred in Roche on 30 Dec 1868, followed by Frances 8 June 1876, both home addresses Woon. No scans available I'm afraid. The OPC site is stubbornly insisting on the marriage in 1831 and I have diligently searched through those held on Familysearch's site, only coming up with this:
I can only suggest that banns were read in 1814 and not sealed by a ceremony, although I cannot locate banns either (but that document may have been lost when nothing came of it). Scans of burials:
James Knight 9, see 1st Feb 2015, scan of his burial:
James Knight 10, see same date, scans:
burial of 1st wife
Monday 19th August 2019
Frederick Robert Knight, see 29th Jan 2015 & 3rd Jan 2017, nothing new
Gerald Hocken Knight, see 6th Jan 2017, no doubt the most famous of all our ancestors, nothing new as the previous study was so detailed.
Grace Knight, see 7th Jan 2017, Oliver's 5xgreat-aunt, still no confirmation, which is a shame. The Cornwall OPC site has many possible marriages, but, as I said, no father is mentioned as he died when she was 3 years old so I shall have to leave it there.
Grace Mary Knight, see 7th Jan 2017, again too early for Registration, and again OPC has many or nothing, and again no father.
(Ozmasinda) Hannah Knight, see 29th Jan 2015, nothing new
Harriet Knight, see 29th Jan 2015 , again nothing new
Harriet Ann Knight, see 29th Jan 2015 & 7th Jan 2017. Slight discrepancies in the emigration document when the family arrived in Australia; her father Robert was said to be "in very good health" but there is a note alongside the (funding of the) rest of the family saying "Knight family not allowed for in consequence of himself being sent to General Hospital". I don't know what that meant as he was a quarryman and miner, not hospital worker, so it must have been as a patient. They had been sponsored by a Mr Marshall, as had the others on that ship, presumably Robert's employer. He evidently survived his illness, if that were true, for another 17 years - and a further 4 children!
Hart Knight, see 29th Jan 2015 & 8th Jan 2017, as I said, several by this name died young in Roche - I can see he was one of 4 in the Roche parish in a 7 year period and he was much the eldest.
Sunday 18th August 2019
Emily Elizabeth Stick Knight, see 23rd Jan 2015, although her story was short, as she died and was buried at age 14:
Ernest Alfred Knight senior, see 24th Jan 2015 & 2nd Jan 2017, burial scan:
Ernest Alfred Knight junior, see 24th Jan 2015 & 2nd Jan 2017, nothing new.
Ethel Mary Knight, see same dates, new info is that her husband owned a general store, was at his death called "merchant" and left £11k to Ethel, worth very nearly a million today. She left it invested, it seems, as she left £19,500 when she died, but this was not a good move financially as the depression in the years between took it down to a value of £663k. However, this does not take into account the move to Kent; Tonbridge is a well-to-do area and her heir (nephew/grandson) to whom she left her legacy was a company director.
Eva Augusta Knight - see Augusta Eva 15th July below
Fanny Knight 1, see 25th Jan 2015, nothing new
Fanny Knight 2, see 26th Jan 2015 & 2nd Jan 2017, nothing new
Fanny Knight 3, see 26th Jan 2915, I have just realised she was the sister of Edward, see 9th Aug below, who died aged 19 in 1841. She died aged 21 in 1846, both at Tresibble. That must have been a harrowing time for the family, although the other 3 brothers lived into their 70s.
Frances (Fanny) Knight, see 26th Jan 2015, where I told her story, full of heartbreak. Her mother died bringing her into the world, then her father had children with the lodger (although he did eventually marry her). Fanny married aged 18 but I suspect he deserted her and she ended her days in the Lunatic Asylum. She died there on 30 Mar 1913 and was buried in Bodmin on 3 Apr. I have found a death of a Thomas Warne in the area the previous year in St Columb Minor, but cannot be sure it is him as the record has no middle name.
Friday 16th August 2019
Ellen Jane Knight, see 1st Jan 2017. Nothing new and hard to prove what I do know, due to the surname being spelled in several different ways, despite being a well-known local name.
Emily Knight 1, see 2nd Jan 2017, I found her marriage - in Bury, Lancs in 1879. They had 6 children in 16 years, the last one Margaret only dying in infancy. They emigrated to Australia when the eldest Norah was less than a year old, and had all the others there. In 1917 an electoral roll record shows Norah (home duties) and Mick (Joseph Michael or vice versa, stockman) at home with Emily (home duties) and William ("lengthsman"). Home was called Plum Tree, Charters Towers, Kennedy, Queensland and was still their address on the death of Emily in 1923 and William in 1932. The eldest son Thomas fought in France in WW1 and was invalided home due to gun-shot-wounds and compound fracture to his leg.
Emily Knight 2, I hadn't mentioned her before as I had so little information. I can now see that she was the one christened on Christmas Day 1862 by the Bible Christian Circuit, at Zoar Chapel, father miner Christopher and mother stated as Jenefer. This was what threw me as she was always called Jane (nee Roberts). The lovely thing is that Emily was christened Emily Betsy Merrifield Knight, after Christopher's mother Betsy Merrifield, but when it came to registration, she was entered as Betsy Emily Merrifield, which caused the search engines to miss her. She can be seen in censuses of 1871 & 1881 at Criggan Down, with her parents & sibs, in the latter described as a Domestic Servant. In March 1890 she sailed on the SS City of Paris to New York and thence to Connecticut
I don't know if she and William Oliver already knew each other; it is very likely as they grew up in the same area and were much the same age. He had emigrated 3 years earlier, but they left it until their first baby was a few weeks old before they married. This was on 19 Mar 1891 in an area oddly (or possibly not) called West Cornwall, Lichfield, Connecticut, where they can be seen in later censuses, so they were there for many years. The odd thing here is that they can be seen back in England for 1901 census. I can't tell whether they were in USA in 1890 as the census is missing. A couple of her siblings were married around that time (1901), so maybe it isn't so odd. William and Emily can be seen living next to the "signal cabin", probably at what is now Lostwithiel station, William a self-employed blacksmith and they had 2 daughters Ethel and Olive aged 9 and 7 respectively. By 1910 they were back in Cornwall, Connecticut, William farming , Ethel dressmaking and Olive at school. As Ethel married Wallace Hart by the next census, there were only 3 at the farm in 1920, although Ethel & Wallace lived only 4 houses away. By 1930 they had moved next door to her parents and can be seen in the census of that year with 2 daughters themselves and a servant/housekeeper from New York looking after them. Olive still lived with her parents, working as a clerk in the Post Office.
The home is still called a Farm, but William is listed as Blacksmith making "Fancy Iron Work". In 1932 Emily died and was interred into the local cemetery, a stone laid in her maiden name interestingly.
although it is definitely hers and alongside a family monument
In 1940 census they can be seen living in Cottage Row, Lichfield with the Harts again 4 houses away. Of course this may all be the same, just renamed/numbered. Ethel had died in 1929 so Wallace Hart (now Postmaster) had remarried and his wife now Mabel. William was by now 76 and Olive still in residence, keeping house for him. He died in 1953 and joined Emily in the cemetery.
Tuesday 13th August 2019
Elizabeth Knight 9, aka Lizzie, see 22nd Jan 2015 & 20th Dec 2016, where I haven't dealt with the 1939 Register for her. She can be seen on the family farm at 8 London Road, Hadlow. Her mother Elizabeth had just died there in the February of that year (Register was taken on 29th September) and listed at the farm with Elizabeth were her 3 unmarried sisters Kate, Lucretia and Hilda, aged 64, 54 and 52 respectively (Lizzie was 60) and there is a redacted line I cannot assign. The younger siblings were either married or dead, so maybe this was a tenant/lodger like the other household members, Mr & Mrs Waller and their child. There is in 1954 electoral roll record at 26 Sutherland Street, London SW1, but it is a common name and I have nothing to link it.
Elizabeth Knight 10, see 22nd Jan 2015 & 20th Dec 2016, burial scan:
but nothing else.
There is another "plain Elizabeth" Knight, born in July 1838 at Roche to James & Grace nee Woon, baptised there on 12 August and diedon 2 Apr 1939 aged 9 months. The death date fits with this photo but as the age is obscure I cannot tell.
Elizabeth Charlotte Knight was another "attempt" by these same parents, but she died aged 3
Elizabeth Treverton Knight, see 23rd Jan 2015 & 20th Dec 2016, nothing new
Ellen Knight 1, see 23rd Jan 2015 & 1st Jan 2017, nothing new
Ellen Knight 2, see 1st Jan 2017, when I suggested the marriage to William Brewer in 1883 may be wrong, as father of the bride is called James. Having looked at the detailed records on the Cornwall OPC site I have reverted to believing this is her. The witnesses signed as Simon Knight and Fanny Brokenshire, so are obviously her father and step-mother-to-be. Grace died on 20 May 1883, so was probably in her final illness, so didn't sign (or maybe even attend). Simon married Fanny a year later, on 29 Mar 1884. Following Ellen & William through subsequent censuses I can see them at Carbis, Roche, William mining China Clay, like most thereabouts. They had 3 children, and they can be seen there too. Also brother Joseph was boarding in 1891 and a Fanny Knight visiting in 1911. I did think this may be Ellen's stepmother but she was with her son Alfred & family, aged 82 and this lady was only 21. It is interesting to see visitors with the surnames Knight, though... By 1911 William had started up his own business from home, delivering coal, assisted by Ellen and son Fred kept the house. Two children of the 5 born to them had died, but all I can find with these parents' names is 2 baptisms for sons called Samuel in 1883 and 1886 with no attendant deaths. Looking into it, these were in St Dennis and I can see they were a completely different family. William died in 1926:
and Ellen followed in 1928, and was buried with him at Roche Council Cemetery on 17 November.
Monday 12th August 2019
Eleanor Knight 1, see 12th Jan 2015, nothing new
Eleanor Knight 2, see 19th Dec 2016, also nothing
Eliza Jane Knight 1, see 16th Jan 2015 & 19th Dec 2016, also nothing
Eliza Jane Knight 2, see 16th Jan 2015, I have now seen the probate document of Rhoda's first husband, as I had thought she was a "rich widow". Far from it; William left her the minimum sum of "<£20". I still don't know why the family went to Cumberland with a small baby (Willie), and it evidently didn't do Eliza much good...
Elizabeth Knight 1, see 16th Jan 2015 & 20th Dec 2016, nothing new, including confirmation (or otherwise) of a marriage late in life and/or death.
Elizabeth Knight 2, see 16th Jan 2015 & 20th Dec 2016, and I see that she was one of those who my colleague assigned to the effects of the Laki volcanic eruption (see 7th July below)
Elizabeth Knight 3, see 18th Jan 2015 & 20th Dec 2016, all that is new is her burial on 3 Jan 1848 at St Columb Major, home address given as Castle Downs.
Elizabeth Knight 4, see 19th Jan 2015 & 20th Dec 2016, burial scan is available, not from the workhouse itself but from parish records
As far as her marriage went, it seems they had banns read in St Austell, both being "of this parish", in July 1824 but didn't have the ceremony until 24 October, witnessed by both Joseph's parents, although they could not write and only "made their mark". Joseph's burial record was 7 pages further on from Elizabeth's, his death occurring 5 months later
Elizabeth Knight 5 aka Betsey, see 19th Jan 2015 (Oliver's great grandmother), nothing new, as there was much detail before.
Elizabeth Knight 6, see 19th Jan 2015, nothing new
Elizabeth Knight 7, another Betsey, see 19th Jan 2015. Nothing new, although I do have a query regarding her burial. The record on the OPC site gives her burial in Breage on 11 Apr 1877, giving residence as Troon Row, but her death was not registered in St Austell until the October.
11 years later Joseph was interred at Treverbyn, not the same cemetery.
Elizabeth Knight 8, see 22nd Jan 2015 & 20th Dec 2016, scan now available of her marriage in Menheniot
Friday 9th August 2019
Returning to "normality", at least for a while...
Eden Knight, see 9th/10th Jan 2015, the only new document is a scan of the Bible Christian baptism record:
Edith Leonora Knight, see 10th Jan 2015, scan of burial record:
Her subsequent sister Edith Annie Knight, also see 10th Jan 2015, was confusing, as Ancestry came up with a complete alternative, parents names the same, married twice (in USA), possibly 3 times, with burial details. But it was not her. I can see she was an entirely parallel person living and dying in America, with "ours" never leaving these shores, born, married, living and dying in Cornwall. Otherwise I have nothing new.
Edward Knight 1, see 10th Jan 2015, nothing new
Edward Knight 2 wasn't actually reported on before. He was born in Oct 1821 in Roche to John & Mary Ann nee Williams and christened there on 18 Nov. Unfortunately he died just before the 1841 census aged 19 and was buried at St Gomonda's on 30 Apr 1841. Thus there are no scans and only the two records.
Edwin Knight likewise, but for different reasons. I found his baptism at St Stephen-in-Brannel on 2 Aug 1840, thus can infer his birth the previous month to Thomas & Betsey nee Hammer, upheld by census returns of 1841-81, with his mother. However, after her death in 1884 I lose track of him, and there are (as I said in 2016) no confirmations of several possibilities.
Edwin Paul Knight, see 12th Jan 2015, a very detailed account so nothing new
Monday 5th August 2019
Back to Wednesday's walk. Proceeding up St John's Road, we passed through St John's Gate and spent some time in the museum there and the Priory Gardens. As my family arrived in the area in 1857, the old church would have still been there, not the one we visited, now a museum. This was very interesting and the garden full of herbs etc. but not really apt here.
the old church 1818
St John's Gate
Number 14 is I understand, now a very modern office block known as The Smithson, built only a few years ago. In 1861 Charles & Jemima lived there with their 4 children and nephew William (Charles' brother James' son), baker, fishmonger, cheesemonger, 2 pursemakers and a schoolchild in their household.
Moving on through St John's Square, we passed through Jerusalem Passage to Aylesbury Street:
In 1861 the pencil-case maker I mentioned yesterday, James Parker, lived in Aylesbury Place with his family, including 5-year-old Emily (my great grandmother) and this can be seen on the contemporary map shown above. As this was all redeveloped as slum clearance a long time ago, there was no chance of finding it, but her youngest sister Amelia Jane Parker worked as a servant in one of the big houses in St John's Street that backed onto the Place, to the west, as you can see in the map above. The closest I can get is a couple of remnants photographed in 2004 (left):
The house concerned became part of the Pollards Shopfitting works in 1900 and the buildings remain to this day (right). The Parkers lived in Aylesbury Place through the 1840s, at number 19 then 11 until he died in 1895 (when he was lodging near the hospital and hes wife Ann was housekeeper to her sister in Lowestoft).
The next phase of the walk took us to Clerkenwell Green, at the end of Aylesbury Street (to the left of map above) and St James' church:
This church was most memorable to me as the venue for the baptism of my Uncle Horrie (great-uncle Horace George Matthews)
His parents were living at 24 Rosoman Street at the time - see later - not far away behind the church.
We went around the church, but although I examined all the wall plaques I couldn't find a Matthews. We then set off westwards, past the Clerk's Well that gives the area the name
First mentioned 1174, lost 1850, rediscovered in building works 1924, so my ancestors never saw it!
Here we chnaged to another of my interests and followed the New River to Percy Circus. This was the first man-made canal in UK, made to bring water to London from the Chadwell Springs, Amwell, Ware a few yards from my house, to what was known as New River Head in the area of Clerkenwell known too as Amwell.
illustrated by the paving alongside the site and names of roads
(these roadnames are the same as Ware, Myddleton named after the founder of the company Sir Hugh Myddleton, who started the process in 1602. There is a Myddleton Road in Ware too, opposite the springs on my road, where my son used to have a paper-round in the 1990s. Unfortunately there was no water to see at New River Head, as the water now goes no further than a reservoir in Stoke Newington. We turned eastwards and walked across to Myddleton Square and Chadwell Street (photographs above) and Spa Green, passing Sadlers Wells, to City University (we had an alumnus with us and he sought out his lodgings of the time). This route took us in a wide circle back to Rosoman Street
This was originally a footpath over the fields, called Bridewell Walk as it led past the former prison, built 1615 and pulled down 1804. Thomas Rosoman was proprietor of Sadlers Wells Theatre 1747-71 but by trade a builder. He built Rosoman Row, good houses on the west side of Bridewell Walk. Merlin's Tavern stood in these fields with large gardens and a skittle ground in 1735, but the gardens were built over in 1833. So to get to St James' church, my family will have crossed the fieldalong what is now Corporation Row, a cut-through alongside Spa Fields playing fields. The numbering of Rosoman Street is confusing as renumbering took place in 1877 and 1936, so what is there now bears no resemblance. The truncated bit that now retains the name does not have houses on it anyway, so I cannot track down number 24 where Uncle Horrie was born. In the subsequent censuses the family can be seen at addresses in the same area of Amwell, 26 Richmond Street, and 5 Warren Street, which likewise I cannot locate.
I mentioed Corporation Row a moment ago, so must introduce another ancestor; Arthur Matthews, son of the fishmonger Charles I mentioned yesterday who married Maria Benson, thus grandson of Charles & Jemima. He was born in 1872 at Greville Street then married his neighbour Ada Bryant in 1896 at the Church of Our Most Holy Redeemer, Exmouth Market, which we next visited:
Again I searched the boards but no Matthewses.
Arthur lived at 8 Corporation Row (the road going off the middle of the map on the right hand side) and worked just around the corner at the Sekforde Arms as a potman. This pub is off the map above bottom right.
It was at this point that I hoped we could eat there, at the bar my ancestor worked at 120 years ago, but they couldn't fit a large party. We wandered into several places to no avail, then ended up at the Crown back at Clerkenwell Green, after which we returned to Farrington Station and home.
A photo showing how close the Crown is to St James', so I suspect many family members would have known it. There has been a pub on this site since at least 1790 and is supposedly where Lenin and Stalin met in 1905.
The other address of significance is 5 Allen Street, where Charles the baker lived and died, then his son Charles lived until they moved to Greville Street. Thus his grandchildren were born there. It was at the eastern end of Aylesbury Street, where it led through to Goswell Street, and is now called Dallington Street. They had all their 9 children there then moved on by 1881 census.
Sunday 4th August 2019
Well, I shall now report on the walk we did around Clerkenwell, but don't worry, I'll try to keep it brief. And relevant.
Starting at Farringdon Station, we met the others at the pub along the road, now called Sir John Oldcastle,now a Wetherspoons pub
This stands on the corner of Greville Street, straight away into my father's tree. If you have read this blog before you will no doubt remember that my 2xg grandfather Charles Matthews came to London after his wife Jemima had the traumatic experience of finding her mother had hanged herself in her house in Bath. He closed up his bakery in Bath and brought the family to London in 1857, and by the next census in 1861 he can be seen baking in Clerkenwell. They lived at 14 St John's Square, then in 1871 at 5 Allen Street. Son Charles married in 1864 (registered in Clerkenwell but I can't find which church) and in 1871 can be seen at 14 Greville Street, as a fishmonger, which he did until his death aged 54 in 1895, firstly at number 14 then at number 8. However, I doubt the shop changed; I suspect renumbering took place.
(from Google Streetview in 2015)
In 1891 census though, the family lived at 2 Cambridge Buildings, Westminster, not at the shop, but his son Arthur remained in the area and I will get back to him later.
Retracing our steps, we passed the station and Smithfield Market and headed off down St John Street. Let me introduce you to another branch of this tree. My great grandmother Emily Jane Parker was born in Clerkenwell to a carpenter who made pencil-cases, in Aylesbury Place, off Aylesbury Road (see later) and met and married Charles, son of Charles & Jemima above, Again I cannot track down which church but I know he was a brass-foundry worker and they settled in Princes Street (which I can't find exactly as it has changed its name; apparently was off St John Street, leading to Percival St). Unfortunately he had a heart condition and died aged 35 at Holborn Infirmary and Emily moved to Taylor's Row, apparently now Wyclif Street also off St John's Street. She was there when she married H J Parkinson, probably a colleague of George, as he was a brass foundry worker too. They married at St Peter's in Clerkenwell Road
and lived at Princes Street, Rosoman Street, Richmond Street, Warren Street and Rodney Street over the years, all in the area. Her son William was my grandfather, born in 1882 when they lived at Princes Street and baptised at St Philip's, Granville Square
This is now gone, so we didn't see it, although we did pass by the site. Apparently the land was undermined by the railway, and it was unsafe, so the church was demolished in 1938. William and his sister Eliza were baptised there, but by the time Horace aka Uncle Horrie came along in 1885 they lived nearer to St James', so baptised him there. More of this tomorrow.
Sunday 28th July 2019
I have been spending time perusing these blogs of previous years, seeking out ancestors who spent time in Clerkenwell in London. This is because I am going on one of our history walks, run by one of my husband's friends. I have found 25 ancestors and will try to attach them to sites we may find on Wednesday. I will bring you notes and/or photos. However, I am a little concerned that much of the area is long gone. But watch this space.
Tuesday 23rd July 2019
Daniel Knight, see 8th Jan 2015 & 18th Dec 2016, the Police Constable. I have a scan of marriage:
also transcriptions of a couple of court cases at the Old Bailey in London, where he was a witness, in 1868 and 1871, and a very interesting document from the police force when he left regular service in 1875:
(this pension sum would be worth £7000 today). As I said in 2015, he went into railway employ, then into the newly-formed CID. I can see from his railway records that he was found asleep on night duty twice in 1886, and removed to other areas in London. Retiring at 65 in 1893, he moved to Bletchley and Frances died there. Fenny Stratford, where he lived when he died, is a place dear to my heart on the canal system:
His son Daniel James Knight, see 8th Jan 2015, scan of his baptism:
new records include the death of his wife Emma, on 4 Jan 1951 in New York. There is a stone commemmorating several members of the family:
at St Michael's Cemetery, East Elmhurst, Queens County, New York
David Knight 1, see 9th Jan 2015 & 19th Dec 2016, was another who emigrated to USA. I gave the details of his demise in 2016, dying of erysipelas aged only 37, and a photo of his mother's gravestone, mentioning him.
David Knight 2, see also 9th Dec 2015 for the full story
David & Mary Ann
I have also seen Kelly's Directory entries for 1893-1910, listing him as cowkeeper of Criggan, Roche. He reverted to his first job, that of farm worker, after a lifetime of mining; first copper, then tin then clay.
Dorothy Knight 1, see 9th Jan 2015. I am still not sure whether hers is the death aged 6 in 1785 (possibly due to volvanic activity) or in 1799 aged 19. If the latter, there is a burial record in Roche, stating "buried in sheeps wool only", which was a statement of the time, to encourage the use of British wool rather than foreign linen.
Dorothy Knight 2, see also 9th Jan 2015. She married George Hicks in 1821, then died having her second child in 1824. I see now that George remarried in Padstow in 1826 to Catherine Randall. They had 3 sons and lived in Padstow for 35 years until they both died there, George in 1861, Catherine in 1867.
Dorothy Knight 3, see 9th Jan, nothing new
Monday 22nd July 2019
Cheveletia Annie Knight, see 4th Jan 2015 & 17th Dec 2016, nothing new apart from her burial document. She died on 26 June 1941 and was buried in Lanivet Church, where she was baptised 75 years before. Her address on death was 21 St Nicholas Street, Bodmin
Christiana Knight 1 (born 1815), see same dates, but as she was "step granddaughter of 4xgreat uncle" I shall draw the line at much seeking. As far as I can see, there is nothing new.
Christiana Knight 2, born 1819, see same dates, aka Kitty, nothing new except scan of her burial record:
Christopher Knight, see same dates in blog, nothing new except I see from the marriage record that there were 3 Janes involved; his new wife Jane nee Roberts and both witnesses were Jane Manhire and Jane Brokenshire. I'm not sure if Jane Manhire was Oliver's grandmother (the age is right), and if so what her relationship was to Christopher. As I said in 2015 blog, this kind of thing gets your head spinning). I have also seen several Directories, but all the same; farmer at Criggan, Roche.
Clara Knight, see 5th Jan 2015 & 17th Dec 2016, Oliver's aunt, nothing new.
Clara Ann Knight, see 5th Jan 2015 & 18th Dec 2016. I see they were Methodists as son John was baptised in Primitive Methodist Chapel on 6th Dec 1899 (born 7th Oct). He died aged nearly 4 and his mother the following year, having his brother Arthur. I feel really sorry for John senior as he was left aged 52, to take care of a new baby and a 3-year-old. It's not surprising that he remarried quickly. By the time Arthur John had emigrated to Canada and married (a Scottish girl) there, it was Annie Heller's name on the paperwork (John senior had died in 1919). Clara's stone in St Austell Cemetery says
"...of Slades, Tregonissey, age 37. Also John, her husband, who died 20 May 1919 aged 67. Also John Wesley their son, who died 3 Jul 1902 aged 3y 10m".
William fought in WW1 and Arthur emigrated, as I said. By 1939, Annie was all alone at 81 Slades Road, as UDD. She died there in 1955.
Clara Mary Knight, see same dates, all that is new is a scan of her death certificate in Canada:
Otherwise I gave all the information in previous blogs.
Sunday 21st July 2019
Cecilia Knight, see 3rd Jan 2015, where I included a photo of her grave that I took on my visit there. The burial has now been placed on the Find A Grave site with another photo. I still cannot find a baptism, even on the Cornish OPC page, so presume it didn't happen.
Charlotte Knight 1, see 3rd Jan too, but I still cannot track down a marriage or burial. I would imagne if hers was the death in Devon in 1905, she would have been buried where her roots were, in Cornwall. However, sister Elizabeth was living in Bovey Tracey, Devon, so she may have registered the death.
Charlotte Knight 2, see 3rd Jan 2015 & 17th Dec 2016. No scan of her baptism, but I did show her marriage in 2016. Her death was in 1905, so caused me much confusion with her namesake above, but as she was buried in Roche churchyard towards the end of the year, the details are clear.
Tuesday 16th July 2019
Bessie Knight, see 21st Dec 2014. I have seen a copy of the marriage certificate:
Other than that, nothing new. Her granddaughter has posted a letter describing her death, but this was merely slipping away through a heart condition. Regarding the intriguing question of Oscar's parentage, his middle name may be a clue; Garland is a very unusual name. His birth certificate names no father and I have been unable to find one.
There was a family called Garland in St Blazey, but Richard had young children of his own...
Caroline Knight, aka Kate, was not mentioned before as the evidence was confused, due to her names. I can see she was born Dec 1845 at Burney Farm, near the Rock in Roche, and baptised at St Gomonda on 9 Jan 1846.The 1851 census had caused a bit of confusion as it is very faded and Ancestry had transcribed her age as 3. She was at Carbis Common with parents and sibs and FindMyPast have her as 5 (better). By 1861 and 1871 she can be seen with them at Bodelva, St Blazey (now the site of the Eden Project. After 1871 I lost her, but was aware that in these two censuses she was known as Kate (odd but my own great grandmother was always Carrie, despite her name being Catherine not Caroline. It seems that these two were interchangeable). The Cornwall OPC has a burial recorded for one of her name in St Dominick, living in Calstock. The worry here is that this is 30 miles away and the age was out by 4 years.
Catherine "Kitty" Knight, see 22nd Dec 2014, where I told the story in fair detail, and nothing new has emerged
Catherine Lambert Knight, see 22nd Dec 2014, was the lady who married a mCustoms Officer from the North and they bounced around the country. The Cornwall OPC have no baptisms for children of James & Emmeline (although they had 8) and no scans have been made of marriage or burials (apart from banns, which may or may not have led on)
I'm not sure what time I will have for this in the next couple of weeks, but we shall see.
Monday 15th July 2019
Augusta Eva Knight, Oliver's aunt, Jessie's great-aunt, see 19th Dec 2014 & 16th Dec 2016, which was covered in great detail. New records are a marriage scan (this being in London):
Also, I wanted to fill in the gap 1911-1939, and electoral roll records did just that; in 1930 she csan be seen in Balham with daughter Eva and her husband, before returning to Cornwall in wartime. She returned after the war and can be seen in Kensington by 1948, at 171 Holland Park Avenue, Kensington, where she lived when she died the following year. All I can see about this house was that it was next door to a vicarage (which may or may not be relevant) and that in 1935 a dental surgeon practiced from that address.
She died about a mile away, in what I suggested in 2016 was a private clinic, aged 83.
Benjamin Knight 1 was Oliver's 4xg uncle. All I knew in 2016 was that he rented Hallew from John Knight, his brother, in 1798. He had been born in Roche to John & Dorothy nee Bray and chrstened there on 27 Mar 1739. He wrote a will on 24 Feb 1809, leaving his effects to his nephew Thomas, son of John, and then died aged 75 at Pentevale, Roche. He was buried on 17 Sep 1814 at Roche.
All I know for sure is that Benjamin Knight 2, was born in Roche to Joseph and Elizabeth nee Mark and christened there on 7 Jun 1779. I have no further information so don't know if he married or when/where he died.
Benjamin Knight 3, see 21st Dec 2014. New records are censuses of 1851 & 1861 at Castle Dinas, St Columb, in the latter spelled "Castleindina", at Castle Downs, where Christiana can be seen alone with granddaughter Elizabeth Jane (daughter of son James, with whom she lived in 1851) looking after her as Housekeeper (aged 13).
Castle an dinas
Then there is now a scan of Christiana's burial:
(this meant she was interred into consecrated plot no. 205 at St Columb Major Cemetery)
Sunday 14th July 2019
Anthony Knight 1, see 16th Dec 2014, Oliver's 4xg uncle. Nothing new.
Anthony Knight 2, see 16th Dec 2014 & 11th Dec 2016, nothing new
Anthony Knight 3, see same dates, was son of AK2 and his first wife. Nothing new.
Anthony Knight 4, see same dates, half-brother of AK3. Nothing new. (There was a court case whereby an Anthony was accused, along with his son Thomas, of obtaining a wooden plank unlawfully. Our Anthonys did not have a son called Thomas and this one was a Clay Agent. The accused was acquitted anyway, although his son got 3 months as he forged an order for the timber. They lived in Egloshayle 10 miles to the north of Roche.)
Anthony Knight 5, see 19th Dec 2014 & 13th Dec 2016. Nothing new.
Arthur Theodore Knight, again nothing new, as I had so much detail before. See 19th Dec 2014 & 13th Dec 2106.
Arthur Tom Knight, see same dates, I may have found Arthur in 1891 census; he was boarding in Wales, working as a coal miner, (along with a Joseph Knight of a similar age, maybe a cousin I am not aware of), under the name Tom. I was wrong about their retirement and deaths in Sussex, though, as I have found Arthur & Ann in 1939 Register. They were still living in Victoria Street, where they had been in WW1, Cinderford, although it appears to be called Bilson Green Road at the time (maybe Victorian things were frowned upon). They didn't last much longer, however, as Ann died the following year 1940 aged 77 and Arthur the year after that 1941 aged 76.
Saturday 13th July 2019
Back to normal now.
Ann Knight 2, see 9th Dec 2016, Oliver's 2xg-aunt, I see the reason I couldn't trace her through life was that she died at or around her first birthday, and was buried in Roche churchyard on 23 Mar 1794
Ann Knight 3, see 6th Dec 2014 (then called Ann2, confusingly and also Oliver's 2xg-aunt), no scan of baptism or marriage. In fact, nothing new, here or in Canada.
Ann Knight 4, see 14th Dec 2014 (Ann3), where she vanished on setting foot in New York. Unfortunately this is still the case
Annie Knight, see 14th Dec 2014 & 9th Dec 2016, scans from Michigan:
Annie Louise Knight, see 14th Dec 2014. This was a mess, to be honest. I discounted the USA connection, but then when I had a closer look at her marriage, I realised it wasn't Ernest she married, but Joseph Bunch, on the same page on the marriage records of Canford in Dorset. So I can move on afresh from here.
They had two daughters, in Dec 1899 (5 months after their marriage) Doris Irene was born in Branksome, where they lived over the butcher's shop in Poole Road
They can be seen there in 1901 census, and in 1905 had Gladys here. However, in 1911 they had moved 335 miles north to live in Byker, Newcastle, where Joseph had given up butchery and was working as a tarmac labourer. I don't know what went wrong with the shop and forced this change, but I suspect Joseph was ill, as he died in 1924 at the age of only 46 and the family moved back south. Gladys died aged only 22 in 1927 in Poole, Dorset and was buried on 1st June in Broadstone. So in 1939 Annie and Doris can be seen alone in Sheringham Road, Poole, Annie UDD and Doris a "tailoress coats and dresses". Annie died there in 1947 and joined Doris in the cemetery. Gladys lived on for another 20 years and died there (unmarried) in 1980.
Friday 12th July 2019
I'm sorry but I cannot access Ancestry.co.uk. There is no point in doing this without it, so I will be back tomorrow.
Tuesday 9th July 2019
The other Amelia Knight, see 1st Dec 2014, who had a tantalising history with gaps. She was baptised at the age of 10 with her sister Charlotte, in Menheniot, then lived with her family at Polpinka through to her teens. In 2014 I couldn't find her in 1881 census, and I now see that she was mis-transcribed and I can see her in Bodmin. She was working in Lower Bore Street for John Cardell, JP and Mayor of Bodmin. as a domestic servant. Tracing the census, I think they lived approximately where the (former) library is:
In my 2014 blog I said that both she and her husband William worked at the asylum, and this was probably where they met. I see now that she was employed there (was not an inmate) on the staff. Scan of their marriage:
I told the rest of the story in 2014, how they lived with a grocer then took over the grocery themselves and she worked there until her death aged 73 in 1932 in St Blazey. She was buried in Rosehill Cemetery; unfortunately when I went there in 2012 I didn't have a list and didn't find anyone. (I'm not sure I would have looked for Kneebone anyway!)
The grocery shop, by the way, is currently looking the worse for wear, the plumbers who occupied it having moved to St Austell in recent years.
Angelina Knight Oliver's second cousin once removed, was born in May 1850 at Tresibble, Roche to William & Kitty nee Roach, was baptised at Roche on 29 May,
died aged 4 at Tresibble May 1854, her mother having died 10 months before, and was buried on 18 Jun in Roche churchyard. In her little time she managed to be "caught" on 1851 census and can be seen at Tresibble aged 1 with parents, two siblings and two servants.
Ann Knight 1, Oliver's great-aunt, see 4th Dec 2014 & 9th Dec 2016, where I was very confused as she married twice and I couldn't find her after the 1861 census, despite finding her second marriage in 2016. I think I have tracked down her death in Devon in 1871, aged 45. If her husband John Webb was the one who died in May of that year in Australia, this may have been where she was at the time of the census, returning here only to die herself. But as it is such a common name I cannot be sure.
Monday 8th July 2019
Alwyne Knight, see 29th Nov 2014 & 9th Dec 2016. Again there is no baptism scan but there is one for his first marriage:
(the Cornish Parish Registers cover 1538-2010 but are few and far between)
There are no scans for his second marriage or any of their burials - there are only 4 Knight burials in Par, and all much too early. I have seen entries in Kelly's Directory for various years, in several parts of Par e.g. 1893, 1906 & 1914.
Amelia Knight, see 30th Nov 2014.
She was the lady who emigrated to Australia, married and built the Railway Hotel, Creswick, Victoria, with her husband and they ran it to their deaths in 1905 & 1914. I have just found an event which will have impinged upon their lives in 1882, when their business was well-established and they may well have been involved in some way:
"No one could have imagined that in the small but prosperous town of Creswick in 1882 there would occur the worst gold mining accident in Australia – a record that stands to this day."
The evening of 11 December 1882 was no different from any other when 41 night shift workers reported for shift at the New Australasia Mine No. 2 approximately 2km from Creswick. The men descended 250 feet down the mine shaft then made their way another 2,000 feet to the face and started mining. Unknown to anyone working at the mine, a dam of water had been steadily building in the disused Australasia No. 1 mine, not far from the face they were working. Some time around 4.45am on the morning of 12 December, without warning, the wall of the reef drive burst from the pressure of the water, flooding the Australasia No. 2 mine and engulfing the workers. Whilst rescue in Creswick would occur within three days, 22 men would not return to their family. The disaster would leave 18 women widows and 63 children orphans. For almost three days the three engine drivers from the mine ran the engines at over 10 times their normal speed, in an attempt to lower the water and save the trapped men. A special train was sent from Melbourne with specialist diving equipment. This equipment was borrowed from the H.M.S. Cerbrus along with competent divers. When the rescue came Thursday morning unfortunately it was too late for 22 men (one body was still warm) and only 5 men came out alive from the foul smelling mine shaft.The funerals of the men took place the next afternoon. Every mine in the district was shut so all could attend the funeral – in fact the whole town shut up shop so everyone had the chance to say their last goodbyes. Shortly before his untimely death one of the trapped miners, John Tom Clifton, forecast that their funeral would be the biggest ever held in Creswick. He was proved right. About 4,000 people marched in the procession, including 2,000 members of the Miners’ Association, with 15,000 onlookers. Within two years Parliament had changed the fund to “The Mining Accident Relief Fund Act, 1884” for the benefit of all victims of mining accidents. The Fund was finally wound up in 1949 long after the last widow had died. A memorial was erected in the cemetery to commemorate the tragedy.
Australasian Mine Safety Journal 2012
The hotel is no longer in existence. Just after WW2 it became a hostel for dutch immigrants and when this was no longer necessary it was demolished. The area nowadays is rather flat and certainly not a bustling township, the railway having been closed for some time (the station is now a kind of museum, as it was itself saved in 2010 by public demand)
Sunday 7th July 2019
If you are a "regular" here, you may remember that my mother-in-law Jessie's father was Oliver Manhire, his mother Knight, grandmothers Retallick and Trethewey, so these are the surnames that make up her tree. Again, for simplicity, I shall give here their relationship to Oliver.
Agnes Knight, (1st cousin 4x removed) see 26th Nov 2014 & 9th Dec 2016. Unfortunately, the Cornish baptisms etc have not been scanned, but the OPC (Online Parish Clerks) have detailed records. Agnes was baptised in the parish of Roche on New Years Day 1773 but unfortunately died just after her 11th birthday. She may well, like two of her siblings, been the victim of the effects of the Laki volcanic eruption in Iceland. This created devastating clouds of sulphur, resulting in lung problems over a wide area and crop failures lasting for years. She was buried on 8 Feb 1787 at Holy Trinity St Austell.
Albert Edward Knight, (4th cousin once removed i.e. 3xgreat nephew of Oliver's 4xgreat grandfather - OK I'm not going to do this every time!) see 27th Nov 2014 & 9th Dec 2016. I thought I had found a good bunch of documents relating to military service but the details aren't correct for this guy. There are several other Albert Edward Knights around the country. The one I favoured was enrolled in the Territorial Force of the Duke of Cornwall's Infantry on 3 Aug 1915 For the Duration, had a father Richard and they both lived in Cardinham, near Bodmin, not far from where he was born. The problem came when I saw the words "under 17 years of age at date of application for discharge". On joining he had given his age as 19 and served 205 days. Now "our" Albert was born in 1866, so was 49 then! Also, he gave Richard as Next of Kin, rather than his wife, and he had died in Feb 1915. So, it does look as if he was too old for the services and remained a Bank Manager until he died in 1927, and I do have a scan for his burial:
Alberta Emmeline Knight, another 4th cousin once removed, see 28th Nov 2014. The challenge here was to find the 1939 Register, but immediately Ancestry came to my aid, putting the page rght in front of my face, so to speak. As expected, the family can be seen at Mount Pleasant, next to Colbiggan Farm, Roche. The A30 used to go through here but was moved, much of the life went out of this area and Mount Pleasant, which used to be a hamlet, is now merely a couple of farms.In 1939 it was already this way, with the page showing individual farms; several cottages in Roche, 2 farms in Mount Pleasant and 3 Colbiggan. The other farm called Mount Pleasant housed Thomas & Phyllis Knight, possible relatives, with 2 closed files, probably children. William was a 77-year-old farmer, Alberta, 68, UDD and son Fred 29, a motor mechanic. Daughter Mary was married (and incidentally had a daughter called Alberta) and elder son Tom had died in 1921 aged 15. No scans for burial, I am afraid (and no details on OPC site as it is late for them). By the way, the A30 is about to be rebuilt and will pass this way again, but I fear it is too late for Colbiggan/Mount Pleasant.
Alexander Adolphus Knight, Oliver's uncle, see 28th Nov 2014. The reason I couldn't find his baptism became clear when I did track it down. The family belonged to a Methodist movement called the Bible Christians, which had formed in the Southwest of England in 1815, and babies were baptised by a band of roving ministers called the Circuit. Typically, Alex was baptised in a "Private House" (presumably Molinnis), when suitable for the church, in this case when he was almost 6 years old. As he moved to the London area as an adult, I have a scan of his marriage:
After this they settled in Hounslow for a while; he can be seen in PO Directory of 1900 at Hambledon Cottage, Hanworth Road (I have looked at this road and there are many houses of the right age, but cannot see any are called Hambledon. Anyway, they weren't there long as the following year they were in Dulwich, and that was where Muriel was born. (Incidentally, if you read 2014's account, where I talked about them living right behind my favourite pub, this is no more. We hope someone will buy it and reopen it as a pub, but it won't be the same). They still lived there when they died, Ellen in 1924 and Alex in 1930. I have searched the Greater London Burial Index I studied a few weeks ago, to no avail, 12 Milestone Road
but maybe Croydon wasn't Greater London then.
Saturday 6th July 2019
William Murray Samways Senior, Ernest's great-uncle, see 6th Dec 2016, has a baptism scan:
but I'm afraid no marriage scan. I still cannot find him in 1851 although his future wife Mary can be seen in Cattistock with her parents, in the dairy. There are a couple of criminal records in the name of William Samwats of the same age, where he was accused of stealing some rope, but I cannot be sure they refer to him. He was "never in custody" and was acquitted of the charge anyway. But it may explain that he went into hiding at the time of the census. The other census he is missing for is 1901, when daughter Emily had died. There is one possibility but he has a wife Sarah and I cannot find a marriage. He died in 1906 aged 82, and there is also a wife Sarah mentioned in the burial in Longburton.
The other William Murray Samways, the father of uncle Ernest, see also 6th Dec 2016, doesn't have a baptism scan but does have marriage and burial:
At this point I come around to the tree belonging to my mother-in-law Jessie née Manhire, whose ancestors I last studied in Dec 2016 - Apr 2017. I apologise in advance but this will be the third run through of some, and fourth of others. Most of them are from Cornwall, and there have been many new records put on by the OPC, so I have hopes it may be of interest.
Tuesday 2nd July 2019
Thomas Samways 1, see 5th Dec 2016, when I was seeking a death either side of the Atlantic. I thought I had found one but it, like so many records, turned out to be that of his son Thomas Junior. I think I was correct in saying he travelled home in 1926 aged 80, to die a year and a half later in Bridport, Dorset. I'm not sure who he stayed with as all his children had gone to America with him and the remaining 4 died there. Scans:
Thomas Samways 2 (Junior), also see 5th Dec 2016, his eldest son. Scans:
I found a death record dated 12 Apr of the first child of his 1st marriage, born prematurely. When I searched again for 1910 census I found him with his parents in North Main Street, Fall River, listed as Thos Jr, divorced wage earner doing Odd Jobs but in full employment. After his second marriage he can be seen in a directory at home at 75 Oak Street, just around the corner from his parents' lodging house.
The other concern was that he was not buried with wife & family, but I see that he died in 1944 in Swansea, Massachusetts, just across the Taunton river, where they had been since 1940, retired. By the time Marian died in 1956 she had moved back across the Taunton to Fall River.
His cousin Thomas W Samways, see 5th & 6th Dec 2016,
I spoke at length about his entry in the 1939 Register, but I am unable to add details of the 6 redacted people, as they are still so. They are, as I said, probably stable-boys etc. Unfortunately in the electoral roll records there are lots of Thomas Samways records but none with middle initial to enable me to pick them from many others.
Another cousin William Ewart Samways, see 6th Dec 2016. I can't find a baptism scan for him, but his wife Alice I can:
and also their marriage:
They moved around a bit, together and separately, in 1911 he was a stoker on board ship but settled over the next decade, having 4 daughters in Dorset. In 1920 he worked with his mother at Bicester Villa, Kennel Ride and also lived with Alice at 2 Dove Cottages, Toller Porcorum until she died there in 1924. As I noted in 2016, after Alice's death her sister came to work as Housekeeper for William in Toller Porcorum. He died there aged 70 in 1957, mother Elizabeth having gone in 1940.
Monday 1st Jul 2019
Mary Elizabeth Samways, Ernest's sister, see 22nd Nov 2016, where she was covered in much detail, which is good because there are no scans or new records.
Their brother Philip Harold B Samways, always known as Harold, also see 22nd Nov 2016. I was concerned about his marriage to Ellen Marie White, as she was only 14, so have removed the first name, as she was known as Marie. I had got this from 1939 Register, so now need to anchor her somewhere else. I see there is a birth in Weymouth in 1921, so this is much more likely as she would be 20 at marriage. However, I cannot find her in 1939 under that name, although I have tracked down her parents in Shaftesbury. I have also found him (couldn't be anyone else as it has his complete name) at 42a Venning Road, Wokingham, Berkshirein 1960. It says this was a Service Vote, which does seem a bit odd. I have looked for milatary records and there are lots in the name of H B Samways (he was always called Harold) but unfortunately these go back to 1928, when he was only 9. Probably safe to just believe this came through his involvement with the development of torpedoes, as I explained before.
Sarah Ann Samways, 2 second cousins of Ernest, born 1871 and died aged 2, then 1874 in Axminster, Dorset, see 30th Nov 2016. You may remember her story: she emigrated to Massachusetts with her family at the age of 9 and ran a hotel with a husband 37 years older (she was 18 on marriage).
She was widowed aged 38 and died aged 47.
Sophia Samways, see also 30th Nov 2016, has new scans:
No marriage scan I'm afraid.
Sunday 30th June 2019
I have wasted a lot of time trying to pad out the story of Martha Samways (daughter of Henry & Mary Ann), but she only appears on two censuses and there are no BMD records for her, so I assume Martha was a middle name she was known by and I cannot identify her by this.
Moving on, Cliff's cousin Molly was really Martha Mary Molly Samways, see 21st Nov 2016
In 2016 I couldn't find her in 1939 Register and postulated that it may have been because she was working in a hospital in wartime. Nothing so romantic, I'm afraid. She was sitting quietly at home with her parents in Weymouth under the name of Mary.
Ernest, her father, was listed as Prudential Agent (retired) and ARP Warden, mother as UDD. Molly was Manageress Confectionary Business and brother Philip Apprentice Fitter/Turner at Whitehead Torpedo Works, as was John Tyler, also at this address. See 22nd Nov 2016, where I went into the significance of this. There is one closed file, possibly brother Jack, who appears to be still alive, so unredacted. I have traced her husband George Alexander Bryan, birth, school entry and marriage in Battersea and Lambeth and his parents' deaths there.
Martha Matilda Samways, Ernest's sister, see 20th Nov 2016
No scans of burial, I am afraid.
Saturday 29th June 2019
Mark Samways, one of Ernest's second-cousins, see 20th Nov 2016 for his detailed story, unfortunately falls outside the scanned area for baptism and marriage, although this is a scan of the listings for marriages in Massachusetts in 1903:
I gave all the details in 2016, but now have a couple more; daughter Catherine was born only 3 months after they married and in 1936 he still had a vote at 400 West Colorado Street, listed as a chef, aged 66. I have also found that both his parents died in Massachusetts too, in 1926 and 1944. It may have been after his mother's death that he moved to LA, as the first voter list he appeared on there was in 1928.
Tuesday 25th June 2019
John Taylor Samways, one of Ernest's second cousins, see 18th Nov 2016, a very interesting story, so please use the tab above.
No other new records.
John William Samways, see also 18th Nov 2016, scans:
(if you look on the left hand side you will see a note "at Chilfrome for Cattistock". I have researched St Peter & St Paul, the lovely church I showed in 2016 blog and found what this note means. Lovely though this church is, it only dates from 1956, so a century earlier babies were baptised in the nearby village of Chilfrome
I have tracked him down in 1881 census now; he was aged 23, working on a dairy farm in Litton Cheney. I cannot find his future wife in 1881, but she grew up in Dorchester and they married in Upwey.
Then they settled in Hobb Lane, Hedge End, Botley, which is nowadays all fairly modern bungalows, and remained there until at least 1927 (last electoral roll record I have for them). The fact that both their deaths were registered in the Winchester registration area suggests that they retired there (12 miles to the north). In 1927 Botley was incorporated into the Eastleigh area, having been part of South Stoneham prior to this, so they had not remained there.
In 2016 I worked on Ernest's daughter Lilian Daphne Hope Samways out of order because I didn't know her full name (always known as Daphne in the family) and it was only due to my studies that we discovered her husband's name, as he had always been "Lefty" only. So see 22nd Nov 2016 for the full story.
This was an even more interesting story than above, so please do pursue it. As I told, Albert junior ended up in a children's home because his father Albert Senior beat his mother, breaking her nose, while drunk, and was sentenced to 13 months in prison. She was an upright soul, working as an officer in the Sunday School and in later years undertaking motor trips in Nova Scotia to raise funds for them. Junior changed his middle name and enlisted in the Army, then took Daphne back to Massachusetts with him.
Monday 24th June 2019
Jane Samways1, Ernest's aunt, sister of Henry James dealt with yesterday, see 11th Nov 2016.
but no marriage scan unfortunately. I have found her death in Hove, just missing the Register by dying in Jan 1939 aged 78. Husband William died 14 years earlier.
Jane Samways 2, see 14th Nov 2016, when I followed her to 1881
(another resistrar in need of blotting paper) but suspect she married a Joseph Smith and unsurprisingly I then lose her.
Jane Samways 3, Ernest's great-aunt, see also 14th Nov 2016,
no marriage scan unfortunately, again. In November 1889 Jane died and was interred in plot A/1389 of Blandford Forum Cemetery on 30 Nov 1889, joined on 18 Oct 1902 by John. In the census of 1901 the previous year he was with daughter Eliza and family, and I suspect in 1891 he was in Wareham with son John and family (although many of the names were spelled weirdly).
John Charles Samways, brother of Jane1 and thus uncle of Ernest, see 14th Nov 2016
The reason they married in Uckfield was that Ellen's family lived in the Kent/Surrey/Sussex area and they bobbed around that area, John presumably following the work (he was a carpenter), having children as they went. When John died in 1907 they were in the Croydon area and he was buried on 13 Apr at Bandon Hill Cemetery. Ellen became a boarding-house keeper, which of courde entailed staying put, so she lived at 17 Allens Road, Enfield for someyears, until she retired. As I said in 2016, she can be found aged 80 in the 1939 Register at 8 Orchard Road, Enfield and died the following year.
Sunday 23rd June 2019
Henry George Samways, one of Ernest's second-cousins, see 4th Nov 2016, where I described this file as "very difficult", due to a duplicate and the fact that he was always known by his middle name, his father being Henry (see below). I can still only find one in 1939 by his name, living with a Matilda Samways, widow, "incapacitated" OAP (aged 85) but I don't know her and cannot find Lily anywhere. If this is him, he was a painter & paperhanger. I have found a death record in the right area in 1973 with the same exact date of birth, making him 91.
Henry John Samways, his father, see also 4th Nov 2016. Scans:
I have found that in 1918 when he died he was living at The Mermaid in Sherborne. He was very comfortable with pubs, as his in-laws ran the Castle Inn, Blandford when he met her. The Mermaid has just been renovated and reopened under the new name Carpenters Arms
Henry James Samways, Ernest's uncle, see 11th Nov 2016. Scans:
In 2016 I couldn't find 1901 census, and the one I have found I think is wrong. So I believe the death of Emma took place in 1899 (there are several errors in this census, including that he was an Ag Lab, rather than sailor). I think that he died just prior to the 1939 Register, in 1935, which is why Ellen is shown at 43 Broad Street, Portsmouth, a widowed charlady, with son James, listed as "AB Mercantile Mariner". He had evidently followed his father to sea. She died in 1953 in Portsmouth, aged 72.
Friday 21st June 2019
Henry Samways, Ernest's great-uncle, see 31st October 2016
So far so good, but I have spent many hours searching the many alternatives here. I outlined the problem in 2016 in that, although he remarried in 1846, I can see no death record for Martha. I have tracked down her childhood from father's name James above, but this only supports the bigamy story. I can see her in censuses of 1841 & 1851, in the former in Wyke Regis working as a servant, in the latter with Henry (tailor) in Preston, Dorset, then in 1861 at The Rectory, Corfe Castle, Cook and Housekeeper. I have also tracked down her death record, probate and burial documents for a death in 1879:
In her probate, it specifies she was "formerly of Wyke Regis, late of Upway, widow, who died at Upway on 26 Apr 1879", leaving effects worth less than £100 to a gardener William Peters, executor. She had a sister Lydia, who explains one of the alternatives I mentioned.
Tuesday 18th June 2019
Ernest William James Samways was Uncle Ernest's son, see 30th Oct 2016, and I have advanced his info significantly today. He was difficult to pinpoint, as both his father and his son were also Ernest. He was often therefore known as William J, and ran a business under this name, listed in 1935 as a "Motor Cycle Agent", based at 14 Crescent Street, Weymouth. I have studied this premises on Google Streetview and see that it has changed hands several times ver the years, but in 2016 before it was renovated you could see the words "For Hire" revealed - I am thinking this may have referred to Motor Cycles for hire or sale in his day:
This was after their marriage, and they may have lived "over the shop". As I said here in 2016, all the children were born in Weymouth, then they moved back to London in the 1940s. I have tracked them down in the 1939 Register before they went, at 19 William Avenue, Weymouth
At that time, Ernest was working as an "Engineering Process Clerk" and also an ARP warden for the area, Kathleen UDD, daughter Angela was only 4 and the other two children are still redacted. She has two subsequent surnames noted too (very helpful; I can see marriages to Cyril Wray and then Stephen Pickering, although not her death yet). By 1948 they had moved to London and can be seen in electoral roll records at 14 Lincoln Road, Feltham, where they remained for some years
When Ernest died, his death was registered in the Hounslow are, which was only 2 miles away, so it may well have been here. By the time Kathleen died in 1995 she was probably staying with son Ernest in Guildford.
Ernest's uncle Froud Samways - see 30th Oct 2016 - I have been desperately trying to fill in his story, as I love the name, but to no avail.
Frederick Samways was around for less than 3 years - see 30th also - but he managed 2 scans:
Helena Samways - see 30th Oct 2016 for her story, as there are no scans or new records.
Monday 17th June 2019
Elizabeth Samways 1, Ernest's second cousin, see 26th Oct 2016. Scans:
Elizabeth Samways 2, Ernest's great-aunt, also see 26th Oct 2016, nothing new.
Elizabeth Hannah Samways, also see 26th Oct 2016, scans:
Emily Jane Samways, see same day. She has a full set of scans:
Uncle Ernest himself, Ernest William Philip Samways, see 29th Oct 2016, has nothing new except a scan of the marriage:
Sunday 16th June 2019
Here we go with the big lists! Instead of 9546 Taylors, my Ancestry list holds 49, which is much better, and only a few in London anyway. So it's not surprising that I came up with nothing.
59 Smiths rather than 25,398 was better, but wasn't productive with new information.
A search for Cliff's great-uncle Alexander Smith didn't produce anything but I knew he was one of the very lucky babies who had a burial plot near home. Charlotte Emily Smith I also knew was buried nearby (in Southwark) but came up with nothing here. 40 years later her mother (of the same name) was interred in ground belonging to London County Lunatic Asylum, but doesn't appear here either - and I'm not surprised in this case! Great-aunt Ellen Smith fitted until I read the smallprint on the burial record, where it said she was wife of George and 20 years older than mine (who was sadly only 20). Henry William Smith I also knew was buried in Lewisham, but there was no sign on this list, likewise grandfather Herbert Henry Sr (1944) and uncle Herbert Henry Jr (1972). I was oddly disappointed not to find a record for Muriel, Clifford's still-born twin. She hadn't been baptised, so would not necessarily have a named record anyway, but I could find no burial record in Kennington under any name in 1934.
In retrospect, I don't think this was worth all the time it took, but you don't know until you try...
Now it's time to get back to the Samways tree. Tomorrow.
Saturday 15th June 2019
There are 2329 with the name Matthews in the Greater London Burials, 256 on my list. So I have gone through those, quite enough but finding no matches.
Similarly 3843 with the name Parker, only 34 on my list but all in London. Unfortunately they are almost all too late. Closest was John Henry Parker, died 1862 but aged 6 months instead of 19 years.
2592 were buried with the name Hawkins, but I only have 24 on my tree. I did find that of Betsy Hawkins, who died aged 39, but unfortunately for this study she had married before her demise and died as Smallwood in Netherne Asylum, which is in Reigate anyway, so not the part of Surrey that is Greater London. However, the next one Charles Hawkins matched up in every detail, his death being in 1862 in Old Brentford and his burial:
Looking at Jane Hawkins I found two more siblings and an admission to the Workhouse in her childhood, but then found a marriage, so negated her death in the name of Hawkins. I have found Nellie Hawkins' school admission but she moved out of London after a time in the workhouse, thus disappeared from this study. I also have the school admission for Rose Hawkins (one of the new siblings I discovered when studying Jane) and her 1939 Register, when she was working as a housekeeper, but I suspect she married in 1941 as there are no Roses on the list. I have found many details about William Henry Hawkins, including marriage and several children, but no death matches up. Harriet's father was also William Henry, and I know his death in 1877, but nothing comes up on this list.
I only have Taylor (9546 in Greater London) and Smith (unsurprisingly over 25,000), which I shall peruse tomorrow.
Friday 14th June 2019
The Wooldridge branch goes back to 1690, but still wasn't very forthcoming, as much of Surrey was separate and did not come into Greater London until recent years,. The only one that was even close was Jemima Wooldridge, who was buried in Esher (not Bermondsey as this record states) aged 23 (not 68) in 1854 (correct year), also William Wooldridge who died 1853 but again wrong place & age.
615 Hattons - ours not in London area
428 Smalls - all in the correct area but the list is generally too early. Our branch goes back to about 1780 but married into the Woodfords in 1870. The first record made me wish it was mine: it was for unnamed daughter of Captain Alexander Small, army surgeon, but we have no Alexes of either kind. Another of unknown name was "stillborn of John" but was born 86 years before our only John. Others I wish I had included John Little Small and Damaris Small, purely for their lovely names.
When it came to the Ingrams, we know all of our branch were in the Bath area until Jemima moved to London with her husband Charles Matthews, but several siblings did too. Charles' wife Charlotte died in 1866 and he in 1890, both in London, but far too late for this list (and he in the Workhouse, so unmarked anyway). Sister Maria in 1879 but she (like Jemima) had married another name. Brother James and Richard died in London in 1886 and 1853, again too late for this list (this last is a shame, as there were 22 Ingram burials in London in 1853 but not ours).
Tomorrow I shall move on to study the branches with over 1000 GLB entries, so I shall see you then.
Tuesday 11th June 2019
continuing with Dance burials:
all 199, none ours
197 Gambles - none ours (although there were 2 babies as yet unnamed. One was a "stillborn daughter of Thomas" born in 1816 and one died aged 16 days in 1831, address Mellick Place, Bermondsey, neither of which fits either. I think a lot of the problem with these is that they are much too early for my trees. As I have outlined here before, cemeteries in London were deemed to be full in mid 1800s and out of town sites were used instead, then cremation took over from 1885. From 2007 reburial has been allowed but people are understantably not keen. This collection is made up of records from 300 parishes in Middlesex 1538-1992, South London 1545-1905 and the City 1754-1855. This is of course limited, but I am very grateful for them, especially if in the future if I can push these trees further back in time (which does, unfortunately on many occasions push them out of London).
There were 147 Woodfords but as our family didn't come to London until 1870 and the latest burial listed was 1857, it wasn't worth studying unfortunately.
The same applies to the Wooldridges, but I will study them as they only came in from Surrey, which may be included here. I shall return later in the week and let you know.
Monday 10th June 2019
Still trawling through the burials:
120 Burleys - only one definitely ours (George), one fits (Samuel) but I have no link to prove it is him. If so, he died a year after marrying, common in women through the perils of childbirth, but rare in 23-year-old men.
3737 Coxes - there were so many I had to work in reverse and search for the 70 on my list (unsatisfactory I know but even the software couldn't cope with lists as long as this). Of course, most of those won't be ours and many of ours didn't die in London. This was totally unproductive, so I shall have to rethink...
199 Dances - I have started on these and will get back to you. I don't expect a lot, as most of my Dances were from Hampshire.
Sunday 9th June 2019
Results of searching the Greater London Burials:
71 Brewsters - none ours
10 Catchesides - all ours
I was very happy with this last item, especially as I found 2 middle names I wasn't aware of, one entire person likewise.and a lot of exact dates of birth/death.
25 Noonans - none ours
10 Hodds - none ours
4 Retallicks - none ours
80 Roffeys, including one female baby, who died before she was registered in 1842, daughter of George the baker. He and Jane had married in 1840 and Henry arrived in 1845, an unusual gap in those days. This partly filled it, and I can see there wasn't even time to baptise her. A similar record stated "infant son of B Roffey, died after 4 hours". I have no Bs in my tree.
19 Samwayses - none ours
I am well aware of the limitations of this, in that in tracing them by name at death it will not detect whether ladies have married into the name, and will miss those who married out of it. When I have more time I will take each separately to follow this up, but for now it is being fairly productive, I suppose...
Friday 7th June 2019
Edward Richard Samways, Ernest's brother, see 25th Oct 2016:
(although this clearly says "Edgar" it is also clearly him). No further news, I am afraid.
Edward Richard B Samways, uncle of the above, see also 25th Oct 2016, unfortunately with no scans or new documents.
Quite unproductive today. However, Findmypast have just added thousands of names to their collection of Greater London Burials, so I am perusing them and will be back...
Tuesday 4th June 2019
Charlotte Mary Samways, Ernest's aunt, see 19th Oct 2016 - I can't find a scan of her baptism, but marriage I can:
Unfortunately, once they moved to Guernsey I lost them, as I only have census records and the Channel Islands were not covered by the 1939 Register.
Dorothy Samways, another of Ernest's second cousins, see 22nd Oct 2016, where I told her story with much detail
Despite distraction by a couple called William H Yeomans and Dorothy H Yeomans, dates of birth out by some 3 years, living in Guildford, Surrey, I have confirmed my couple were in Cardiff, his home town, in 1939, with two closed files and another family. William was a motor mechanic and Dorothy UDD. She died in Cardiff Jan 1972 and William died there too on 4 Jan 1974, leaving £7152.
Edward Samways 1, uncle Ernest's great grandfather, see 24th Oct 2016
marriage 1 1820
to Maria Murray, who died aged 32 and was buried at St Mary & St John, Melcombe Regis:
No scan for marriage 2 unfortunately, but Elizabeth died aged 43 and was buried 7 Feb 1844 at Winfrith Newburgh:
No scan for his third marriage either, but as I said in 2016 both he and third wife Fanny died within a month of each other and were buried together in Wyke Regis:
Edward Samways 2 was his son, see also 19th Oct 2016, Ernest's grandfather.
Again, my account in 2016 was very detailed, so I advise you to use the tab at the top of this page.
(I am so sorry about the condition of this - they obviously badly needed some blotting paper!)
No new information except PO Directory records show he had business addresses of Queen's Row and High Street in 1855, and when 1871 census showed him visiting in Alvestoke to prepare for relocation, this directory shows his new premises in 1875 at Clay Hall. This may have been the address Haslar View they remained at for another 20 years, when Edward retired and they moved 10 miles west to Fleet End, Warsash. His death in 1918 was registeredin the Fareham district, which includes Warsash. Annie continued to live there until at least 1930 but was in Gosport when she died in 1937 (so just missing the Register).
Monday 3rd June 2019
Charles Samways, father of twins Barbara and Helena, see 18th Oct 2016 (and yesterday for Barbara)
The lost census records are found, and show him in 1871 a 13-year-old stable boy (one of 19) at Pentridge (immortalised by Thomas Hardy as Trantridge) and in 1881 he was already a groom at Cumberland Lodge, Windsor Great Park. He was one of 6 grooms at what was called the HRH Prince Christian Stables, Windsor Great Park. Cumberland Lodge was and is very spectacular, so it is no wonder he lived and worked there for at least 20 years, and brought up his children there. (Prince Christian was Queen Victoria's son-in-law, married to her 3rd daughter Helena, and was Ranger of the Great Park from 1867)
Cumberland Lodge is shown here in the centre, with the stables to the right. It is now a conference centre and has been very well maintained. Apparently Roald Dahl attended one and was so impressed he featured Cumberland Lodge in his book the BFG
inside the lodge
Charles and his family lived in the upstairs rooms, the lower part in those days more open-plan for the horses. As I said in 2016, when he died on 20 May 1905, tragically aged only 47, they lived at Kennel Ride, Ascot and he was buried at St Michael & All Angels, Sunninghill
One thing I regret in this story is that I never discussed it with Cliff (as I only found out 3 years after his death). He would have loved the fact that an ancestor of his worked as a groom for royalty!
Charley Samways, was his nephew, 2nd cousin of Ernest, see 19th Oct 2016.
With his record, I struggled as I had nothing after 1911, when he was 17 years old, living in Sherborne with his sister and her family, so he could have gone anywhere after that. He too was a groom, one of three in that household. Armed with this information, I have traced him here to Hertfordshire, where he married Florence Sadgrove from Harpenden in the April quarter of 1928 at St Albans. Electoral roll records show that he lived a The Kennels, Kinsbourne Green and Florence appeared there with him from 1928.
1987, apparently 1991
Built in 1866, the kennels were used to house the hounds belonging to Luton Hoo (big local stately home and grounds), used from 1876 for the Herts Hunt until in 1939 this was transferred to Houghton Regis, Essex as a wartime measure and the kennels site used as an Ordnance Depot. In 1950 the kennels buildings were converted into a dairy farm for Luton Hoo estate, and recently into residential property. No. 2 sold last year for a million.
So in 1939 Register, Charles and Florence can be seen at The Stables, Houghton Hall, both working as Domestic Servants. Charley died in Oct 1972 in the Luton area aged 77 and Florence died aged 76 in Biggleswade Jan 1973.
Sunday 2nd June 2019
Annie Samways, Ernest's second cousin, see 17th Oct 2016 - scans:
but no new records.
Barbara Samways, another second cousin, also see 17th Oct 2016 - I can't see baptisms for any of this family, and the surname of her husband had proved difficult as Camm can be mis-spelled in many ways, so I can't find a scan of marriage. I have found out more about him though: born Henry Walter Camm in Sunninghill, Berkshire on 17 May 1895 he too was a twin and was also not baptised. In 1901 and 1911 he can be seen in Sunninghill with the family, his father a carpenter/joiner and in the latter Henry was baker's errandboy. He evidently trained as a joiner, like his father. He enlisted in the Royal Naval Air Service, completing 8 trips in WW1, then was discharged to the RAF in 1918. Presumably he met Barbara in Sunninghill, as they both lived there in their teens, and married in Jul 1923 in Windsor. They settled in the area, as over the next 48 years they can be seen on electoral roll records at various addresses close by:
1930 Bicester Villas
1935 Crispin Cottages (and 1939)
1945-60 Crown Cottages
1965 Queens Gate Cottages
All of these addresses are within a few miles, nowadays near Legoland, around Windsor and Ascot. When Henry died on 16 Jan 1971 it was at 28 Queens Gate Cottages, which may be modern-day almshouses
leaving £700 to Barbara, but she died too a few months later.
Beatrice Mary Samways, Uncle Ernest's sister, see 17th Oct 2016.
As you can see from the notes on this, it occurred on Easter Sunday, and the part of Chickerell where they lived was called "Charlatan". I can't find any reference to this, but, as I said in 2016, they lived on Chickerell Road, next to the Marquis of Granby pub. This is still there but is modern, so I think the site of their house is under the road junction alongside. I cannot track down her or her future husband Frank Jabez Smith in the 1901 census, but they married in 1904 in Weymouth. Having said that, he was generally very useful in using his middle name, allowing me to see he attended Stanley Street School in Lewisham (born in Deptford 30 June 1874) and then joined the navy. He was a Freemason in 1900, giving home address as Whale Island, Portsmouth and he was a Petty Officer. I can see he paid funds to at least 1909. Meanwhile, Beatrice was at 133 Abbotsbury Road, where she had six children. Frank served in the navy in WW1 and received a medal, although I cannot access further details. In 1920 he sailed to New York on the SS Adriatic, serving as an Able Seaman, giving home address as 9 Maycroft Road, Weymouth (confirmed by electoral roll 1921 for both of them)
Frank didn't wait for the Register, as he died in Jan 1937 aged 62. So, Beatrice is seen at the same address, listed as widow, with son William, brewer's clerk, his wife Evelyn née Dunkley, who was a shop assistant in a chain store, selling dresses, and their 16-month-old son Anthony. When she died in the July quarter of 1953, Beatrice was 69 and her death was registered in Hayling Island, Hampshire.
Saturday 1st June 2019
Alice Samways, Ernest's aunt, - see 16th Oct 2016 - here is the baptism scan from Holy Trinity, Weymouth:
I lost her previously in 1888, after her mother died and her father remarried, but I have now discovered that on 19 Dec 1889 in Gillingham, Kent she married John Stanton. At this point he was in the army, a 27-year-old Sergeant in the Royal Engineers, and they lived in married quarters for a while (presumably why they married in Kent). His army records are very detailed (as usual), but I shall forego the personal description and tell you of his career. In 1883 he had been an apprentice carpenter for 5 years in his home town of Crewkerne, Somerset, and enrolled for a period of Short Service with Royal Engineers 40th Company as a Sapper. He was posted to Hong Kong and in 1886 he was promoted twice; in March to 2nd Corporal, then in May to Lance Corporal. In 1887 he returned to Gosport, UK, and a further promotion took him to Corporal. Another promotion 18 months later to Sergeant led to him signing up for an extension to take his service to 12 years. 1891 census shows us that he was living back in Alverstoke, at 5 Marine View, alone with Alice. The following year John extended his service contract to 21 years, and took several exams; Jun 1893 Electrician Skilled, Nov 1893 Certificate of Musketry, May 1895 Electrician Superior and Dec 1898 Lab. Mining Very Superior (odd names, these qualifications!). In 1896 he had been promoted to CSM and in May 1901 to Quartermaster Sergeant (QMS). On 11 Jan 1904 he was discharged with a pension as a QMS. 1901 census record appears to be missing, but by 1911 they had moved 50 miles east along the coast, to Hove, and can be seen at 41 Leighton Road
with John's niece Gladys Stephens. John, by this time 48 years old, was a Chelsea Pensioner and worked as an "instructor at a prep. school" of which there are several very close by. In 1914 he signed up again for WW1 but only served a year (invalided home; he was 52). In 1939 Register they can be seen at the same house, with a baker and wife, also one of John's sisters Mahala, living on "private means". Very shortly afterwards, John died aged 77, leaving £1427 to Alice. Alice lived in the same house for another 21 years, and died there aged 96, leaving £3313 to two of his nieces, one a spinster, one a widow, who may have looked after her in her later years.
Alice Louisa Samways, Ernest's sister, see also 16th Oct 2016. Scan of baptism:
She was another who married a serviceman, this time in the Navy
Witnesses to the marriage were Alice's 3 eldest siblings and one A L Burton (obviously not Alice herself), who I cannot identify. Electoral Roll records show that they lived in Weymouth in 1913-15 and were still there when Alice died in 1933 then William in 1938.
Friday 31st May 2016
As this is the tree of Cliff's uncle-by-marriage Ernest Samways, I shall give you the relationship to him, rather than Cliff, as it gets rather complicated otherwise
Agnes Samways - see 5th Oct 2016 - baptism scan
As she didn't marry, the next new piece of information is her burial. I did have doubts about this but it seems that her death was registered in the Bath area for some reason (odd because it is 42 miles away and there is one in Blandford), but she was buried in Blandford Forum Cemetery, where the family lived
in plot A/1474, where someone called Annie Lawrence had been interred in 1886, 15 years earlier.
Agnes Blanche Samways - see 8th Oct 2016 - Ernest's 2nd cousin - hers is an interesting history, please do go to the 2016 tab above and read it.
husband Frederick's burial
Tuesday 28th May 2019
Thomas David Roffey 1, son of Thomas of yesterday, - see 30th Oct 2014 - no baptism, the only one I could find in the area was for a Thomas Christmas Roffey in 1811. I almost wish it was mine, but had the wrong parents. I do have a marriage scan though:
Electoral roll records show him at St Mary Street from 1856 and we know from the census that the family lived at 13 Coleman Street by 1871, where Martha died in 1878 and Thomas the following year. They were both buried in Woolwich Cemetery, in plot W/484, which was presumably bought for daughter Jane, who died aged 14 in 1859, followed by Thomas David Junior in 1864, then their niece Eliza Epsley who died aged 1 in 1871. Then Martha joined them on 29 Oct 1878 and finally Thomas David Senior on 1 Jan 1879.
Thomas David Roffey 2 was his son - see 30th Oct 2014 - who died aged 29 on 2 Dec 1864 , so all I have is a baptism scan:
Thomas James Roffey died even younger, so I don't think I have mentioned him here, but now I do have a couple of scans:
both at St Mary Magdalene
William Eldridge Roffey - see 30th Oct 2014 & 4th Oct 2016 - son of Thomas & Jane from yesterday - I have lots of scans:
Elizabeth died aged 36 and was buried at St Mary Magdalen
When William E died he was living with son William S and was buried at St Thomas, Charlton on 27 Dec 1863,
William Richard Roffey - see 5th Nov 2014 -
I can't find a scan of the marriage, unfortunately. When Lucy died she was buried in Charlton Cemetery plot E/CON/327, where there were already 3 of their children who died 1896-1919. When William died in 1938 they chose to put him in plot E/CON/324 nearby with 5 others 1890-1905, which seems strange but maybe none of the surviving children objected.
William Stanfield Roffey - see 30th Oct 2014 - baptism scan:
interesting to see Elizabeth was known to the vicar then by her middle name Rebecca. Marriage scan:
Martha was under-age, being 19, and majority was 21, but it was not a "shotgun wedding" as Sarah didn't arrive until 1854. When William S died, he was interred into plot E/CON/328 (next to his son WR's) on 1 Jan 1898 and Martha joined him there 6 years later. 3 sons followed in 1916, 1929 & 1931 and daughter-in-law Julia in 1951 (son Edward's wife).
William Stephen Roffey was his eldest boy, and unfortunately died in infancy aged almost 9 months.
on 4 Feb 1855 at St Mary Magdalene
at St Thomas' Charlton.
Now, at this point in 2016 I went on to the Samways branch of Cliff's tree. As I explained at the time, they may be a little obscure but Cliff himself asked me to study them some years ago, as he was very fond of his Auntie Beat and the family she married into. As I have not studied them since, I shall run a check now, well starting Friday.
Monday 27th May 2016
Stanley Gordon Roffey - see 29th Oct 2014 -
I have found quite a lot more on him now. Firstly his baptism, although there is no scan to show you, I can say this took place on 12 Jun 1880 at St Paul's, Birkenhead, Cheshire
This church was called St Paul's Working Mens Church, was demolished and rebuilt in very modern style in 1978, but this sketch was from the year his baptism took place. In his 20s he worked in London as a shipping clerk (oddly enough the same line of work as his 2nd cousin twice removed, Clifford Smith did 50 years later)
On 21 Aug 1910 in Highbury, where he was living, he married Florence Emma Matthews and the following year they had a son Gordon, in Birkenhead. He was followed by daughter Kathleen in 1913, also in Birkenhead. More about her later. Stanley was working for the Post Office and over the next few years moved about with the work as a "Wireless Telephone Operator". 1915 he worked in Southend, 1916 in Braintree - both in Essex - then 1920 in Caistor, 1922 Grimsby and 1928 Mablethorpe, all in Lincolnshire. In 1937 Florence died aged 56 and the family were back in Birkenhead. Stanley moved in with his brother Alfred at 19 Clarendon Road (see 15th Apr below) and can be seen there in 1939 Register with daughter Kathleen I mentioned above. In 1947 she married Joseph Davey (Joe), who was well known in Wallasey, where they lived. He owned a venue which unfortunately failed, then got involved in another called The Cavern, famously where The Beatles began and the rest of the story is legend.
Kathleen and Joe
Stanley died in Birkenhead in the July quarter of 1968 but I know no more.
Stephen Francis Roffey - see 20th Nov 2014 - nothing new
Thomas Roffey - see 30th Oct 2014 & 4th Oct 2016 - scans of 1771 baptisms at St Mary Magdalene:
and on the next page
I had another search for the marriage: as they were both baptised and buried at St Mary Magdalene church they must surely have been married there. Annoyingly, the list of marriages I can see starts in Aug 1796, the month son George was born, so they probably married a year before. Burial scans:
Sunday 26th May 2019
Sarah Grace Roffey, the aunt mentioned yesterday, see 24th Oct 2014 - scans:
When she died she was interred into plot Q/168 at Woolwich Cemetery on 25 Apr 1868, then Henry joined her on 15 Jan 1887. They had the plot to themselves.
The final Sarah Roffey previously had the middle name of Grace too, but checking through now I cannot find where this came from, so have removed it.
I have also amended her death as the 1871 census I had with her son Frederick had mis-matches with his age and their places of birth. As Charles was buried in Camberwell Old Cemetery I would expect her there but he was interred into plot 40/2600 with 15 others, all strangers, over a period of just 2 weeks. I cannot find adeath for Sarah, but she may have married and have a different name.
Sidney Herbert Roffey - see 29th Oct 2014 & 3rd Oct 2016 - baptism scan:
but no marriage scan I am afraid. As I said before, he was useful to me in that he always used his middle name. Thus I can trace him through the years, including 1939 Register, where I have found him living in Battersea, working as a barman at the pub known as the Prince of Wales
now reborn as the Lost Angel. In the years just prior to this he had a business address as an accountant 1920-1938 in The Grove, West Wickham then after the war at 174 Minard Road, Hither Green. When he died on 2 Jan 1961 it was in Farnborough Hospital, Orpington and I cannot access Bromley borough's burial/cremation records for that year (the hospital closed in 1998 and has been rebuilt as Princess Royal Hospital). When Lilian died in 1974 she was cremated at Hither Green on 18 Mar and Sidney may have followed when he died on 2 Jan 1961. I cannot see a record, but there was a Roffey grave removed in May of that year with no Christian name recorded.
Stanfield Parkinson Roffey - see 24th Nov 2014 & 5th Oct 2016 - nothing new. When he died he was interred into the family plot E/CON/328 in Charlton Cemetery with his parents and brother Stephen & nephew Charles, his son. Afterwards (20 years later) they were joined by sister-in-law Julia Roffey, wife of brother Edward. His wife Emily didn't die until 1963, when the cemeteries were closed, so her death was registered in Middlesex and I can't locate burial/cremation.
Saturday 25th May 2019
Sarah Roffey - see 24th Oct 2014 - daughter of John & Sarah - was rather sparse in terms of records, and remained so. Thus, although I may have found her death and burial, I cannot prove they are hers. She was last seen aged 36 in 1871 census, working as a servant in Brighton. The possible death was in Godstone, so she may have been working there. However, the age is wrong. Having said that, I only have her word for this, as there are still no birth records. In 1841 she was stated to be 6 (although that census was notorious for rounding up or down, even that was usually correct for children), in 1851 and 1871 16 and 36 but census information given by employers is unreliable too. If the "new" death & burial is correct, she was interred into St Nicholas churchyard in Godstone (living/working there) aged 46 on 26 Feb 1876. There is also a death registered in that quarter for her in Woolwich, maybe registered by her parents.
Sarah Adelaide Roffey, Cliff's great great-aunt - see also 24th Oct 2014 & 28th Sep 2016 - scans:
As you can see, this raises the problem of further records abroad, as both groom and his father were in "Military Service of Sardinia". After marriage it seems Sarah & John lived in Napoli, Italy for some time, having son Ernest there:
I don't speak Italian. If anyone reading this could transcribe/translate it for me I'd be very grateful.
I have had no luck with records in USA after 1865, as there are so many different spellings.
Sarah Ann Grace Roffey - see 24th Oct 2014 & 1st Oct 2016 - scans:
(it's strange that at her baptism the middle name chosen was then dropped. She evidently liked the name Grace, as she made sure it appeared on her marriage - albeit as an error correction - and used the name for her first - and only as it turned out - daughter. Ironically it was the use of her father's middle name that confirmed she was the same one). She had been named after her aunt Sarah Grace, who died shortly after her marriage, so they may have been close. Charles died in 1903 and was buried 23 Jan in plot E/63/A in Woolwich Cemetery, and Sarah joined him 13 years later on 28 Apr 1916. They had the plot to themselves.
Sarah Elizabeth Roffey was the eldest of William Stanfield's 12 children - see 31st Oct 2014 & 4th Oct 2016 -
(the first 5 children were baptised). No scan of marriage, unfortunately. I can see that Sarah lived at 440 Woolwich Road, Greenwich from 1918 at least, and we know she was there in 1939, and I suspect died there in 1943. In 1892 William bought plot E/CON/325 at Charlton Cemetery as daughter Rebecca died aged 7 and was interred there on 12 Jul 1892. A baby brother Charles Samuel followed almost 5 years later, then a Charles William in Dec 1901 (I cannot track him down but I suppose he may have died before being baptised). William was interred there on 9 Nov 1937 and Sarah on 11 Mar 1943. Daughter Eliza Louise followed on 9 Jan 1963, the final interment into this plot.
Tuesday 21st May 2019
Percy Harry Roffey - see 19th Oct 2014 & 19th Sep 2016 - scan of baptism with brother:
No scan of marriage I am afraid. Further electoral roll records have confirmed the family movements I knew, until the end. In 1936 the address moved from 194 Amesbury Avenue, Streatham (where they had been since 1918 at least) to 54 Upper Mulgrave Road, Cheam, living above the shop. In 1949 they moved into number 224 and that was his home address when he died:
(I had thought the number change was a mistake, but this looks to be where they retired to. I'm not sure if the flyover next to it was there then, Belmont Rise). Percy died after 2 years there, Ada after 11. In 1953 Ada lived there with her son Edgar and sister Mary Ann Barker. Percy and Ada were both buried in plot CX/32 Sutton Cemetery, Percy on 5 Dec 1951, Ada 6 Aug 1958. I think they kept the shop on, as that address was given on Ada's death, although by then she had moved in with daughter Eunice.
Rebecca Mary Ann Roffey - see 17th Nov 2014 & 4th Oct 2016 - nothing new, but I am convinced she was the lady who died aged 103. Unfortunately I cannot access local newspapers of the time as Sussex cover only goes to 1946 and this was 1967.
Rosetta Ruth Roffey - see 19th Oct 2014 & 19th Sep 2016 -
No marriage scan unfortunately. As I reported before, they moved to Nantwich, Cheshire in the late 1870s - son Robert was born in London, but moved with them to Cheshire and married there. His wife Rosa was buried with his parents in Crewe Cemetery on 1 Mar 1900. Rosetta had been interred into plot B/2507 on 9 Mar 1895, then Frederick 21 Apr 1899. Robert then moved on to Salford with his daughter Violet.
Ruth Roffey Cliff's great-aunt (after whom his twin who died was no doubt named) - see 23rd Oct 2014 & 19th Sep 2016.
New records are marriage scan:
and a photograph another relative clipped from a wedding photo taken in 1929 (son Victor)
Unfortunately, as she died in Tooting in 1954, I have no details of her burial/cremation, but this was probably at the Lambeth Cemetery there.
Monday 20th May 2019
Maria Matilda Roffey - see 16th Oct 2014 -
When she died in 1866 she was interred into plot I/366 at Woolwich Cemetery with her parents (see 29th Apr below)
Martha Roffey - see 17th Oct 2014 & 17th Sep 2016 - scans:
Their son Seymour Crowfoot confused me for a while, as he married a Marth Mabel, but the records I saw were his wife, not mother. William died 1913 and Martha in 1918, both buried in Islington Cemetery, Seymour in 1949 and his wife Martha Mabel in 1947 in Camberwell Old Cemetery (which I visited in 2016)
Mary Ann Roffey 1 Cliff's great great aunt - see also 17th Oct 2014 -
baptism with cousins
For some reason, there is not a scan of the marriage. This is a shame as I wanted to see his occupation. In 1851 he was listed as cheesemonger, along with the rest of his family, but by 1861 he was a railway clerk. I have a (very faint) scan of his railway record. Apparently he joined on 27 Jul 1852 and worked at Paddington station (which was why they left Woolwich) until he was dismissed in June 1870 (no details). This was why he stated in 1871 census that he was "railway clerk unemployed", although in 1881 he was back working for the GWR again, as was his son George. It seems he was re-employed from 24 June 1872 as a Shop Clerk, retired in 1890 and died in 1897. What I find amusing is that on his son Frederick's marriage in 1891 he calls himself Gentleman, instead of Railway Clerk Retired. Mind you, at his death he left effects worth £497 to son George, describing him as Gentleman, and as we know he worked for the railways too.
Mary Ann Roffey 2 - see 17th Oct 2014 - scans:
When Mary Ann died aged only 44 in Jul 1886, she was buried in Camberwell Old Cemetery.
Mary Ann Roffey 3 - see 17th Oct 2014 - nothing new except that when she died, she was not interred into the "family plot" but instead was the 4th of 11 burials in plot 20/344 in Woolwich Cemetery (I don't know the others)
Mary Elizabeth Roffey - see 18th Oct 2014
I still cannot track down a scan of marriage, unfortunately, as Ancestry doesn't have Cams or Northants (Girton is on the border) and Findmypast just has a transcription. But due to this I know that groom's occupation was groom and his father was a thatcher. I think I have tracked down a death record for Richard; he died when they were both working in Petersham, Surrey and he was aged 53. He was buried in St Mary's churchyard, Feltham on 2 September, which explains why he was not there in 1871 census. As I said, I think she ened her days as an "inmate" in Marylebone Alms Houses, St Johns Wood. There was a death registered in Camden in 1891 and a burial on 12 June in Manor Park Cemetery.
Sunday 19th May 2019
I am so sorry for the hiatus; I have been unwell.
Joseph George Roffey - see 21st Nov 2019 & 5th Oct 2016 - new details are that 1939 Register at 84 Rectory Place has the previously redacted file open, that I suggested was George, and sure enough it is. I cannot find scans of baptism or marriage, unfortunatrely, for Joseph. When Emma died in 1954 she was cremated at Honor Oak Crematorium on 27 Aug.
Kate Elizabeth Martha Roffey - see 13th Oct 2014 & 13th Sep 2016 - nothing new
Manlius William Roffey (Cliff's great grandfather) - see 16th Oct 2014
I have been examining the Post Office Directory of 1860, which shows him at 29 Artillery Place, (since built over by the barracks), between the General Abercrombie pub and the Queen's Arms (Hotel in 1901). There was also a pub at no. 48 The New Gun, all now gone, but I was amazed at 3 pubs in so short a road, comprising only 60 dwellings! He was listed as a baker, and the bakery had dining rooms run by Mrs Ann Ford on one side and James Daniel, bootmaker's house on the other.
After marriage, they moved to Walworth, rather up-market now but in those days made up of shopkeepers mainly, and had 2 daughters there. Unfortunately, living in Wandsworth when he died in 1891 and Isabella in 1904 means I cannot find recordsof their burial etc.
Saturday 11th May 2019
Jane Sarah Roffey - see 10th Oct 2014 & 12th Sep 2016 - scans:
When Jane died, on 14 Apr 1912 in Woolwich, she was interred into plot X/227 to join Edward & Emma Marriott, who had died in 1871, just prior to Timothy. Although he was also in that cemetery, it was in a different plot. Emily Marriott joined them 4 years later, but I can't see how the family related to ours. It must have been because there was no more burials allowed in plot T/158, where her family were:
1858 brother John
1872 husband Timothy
1876 sister Sarah
1878 mother Sarah, father John and nephew Charles
1880 brother-in-law Charles
1893 sister Eliza
John Roffey Senior - see 13th Oct 2014 & 13th Sep 2016 -
no Kentish marriage scans I'm afraid but for burial details see above.
John Roffey Junior - see same dates - I can see where he ended up - in plot T/158 - in 1858, which matches up with the death record I found, but still doesn't explain his whereabouts in 1851, or his lack of birth/baptism records. He may well have been a twin of Ebenezer, and all I know of him (Ebenezer) is his death. Strange.
John Pratt Roffey - see 13th Oct 2014 -
As I said when dealing with his father George (see below) he was the first to be interred in plot I/366 at Woolwich Cemetery, when he died aged 33.
John Richard Roffey - see 13th Oct 2014 -
Before, I couldn't find anything on him, but the Greenwich cremation I just found dated 2010 would make him 199 at his death, so I don't believe that is him. Unfortunately, that is the only record using this middle name.
Tuesday 30th April 2019
Henry James Roffey - see 25th Sep 2014 & 12th Sep 2016 - scans:
(sorry the marriage was so faint - it's not surprising the transcription was so awful. I nearly missed it as the bride was Sarah Wm Rossell and the groom's middle name Jame. This would no doubt have upset father of the bride, a copper-plate printer). He died Jan 1904, his death was registered in the Greenwich area and on 16 Jan he was buried in Nunhead Cemetery with 19 others.
Henry Thomas Roffey - see 3rd Nov 2014 & 4th Oct 2016 - I have a baptism scan for him:
but not of either of his marriages. He purchased plot N/263 in Charlton Cemetery and all four family members ended up in it, firstly daughter Martha, interred 30 Dec 1921, then first wife Fanny 27 Aug 1924, then Henry himself 8 May 1952 and finally second wife Anna Maria/Hannah 6 Dec 1956.
There is another Henry Thomas Roffey on this tree, but as one of William & Lucy's 11 children and a mere 3rd-cousin-once-removed, I will not bring him to you. Suffice to say his records have been a nuisance!
James Roffey 1 - see 26th Sep 2014 - scans:
burial aged 9
James Roffey 2 - Cliff's great great-uncle - see 26th Sep 2014, which has a lot of detail - scans:
When he died on 8 Jan 1898 he joined his parents in the family plot at Woolwich Cemetery (see yesterday) on 12 Jan, then the following year Annie joined them.
I told the story of Sir James Roffey on 9th Oct 2014. I can add scan of marriage:
after which he set off on his naval career, as Chief Engineer aboard the Devastation, then the Sutlej, both in 1860. In 1883 he did a stint on board the Pembroke until 1888 and troopship Crocodile in 1890-1892. He had been retired for many years (he was aged 78) when King George V knighted him in his coronation honours list and died the following year. He may well have served with the king in 1880s, so they may have been old friends.
Monday 29th April 2019
Ancestry is better this morning. However, all the hints I could not see yesterday involving Emma were regarding the baptisms of her children, so I shall move on...
Cliff's great great grandfather George Roffey - see 19th Sep 2014 & 12th Sep 2016 -
(no marriage scan I'm afraid). As I said in 2014, they had a son in Oct 1817, 4 months before their marriage. He was baptised George Edward Roffey in Brighton on 8 Nov 1817:
They took him back to London, married and set up home in Rotherhithe (Clarence Street above was there, now called Canon Beck Road) but unfortunately baby George died aged 1 and was buried at St Mary, Rotherhithe on 5 Jul 1818. They moved to Woolwich to join the rest of the family, George worked as a baker there and they lived at Warwick Street. In the December they had another son, who they also called George, baptised him - see below - at St Mary Magdalene, and remained in the area for the rest of their lives. On 29 Aug 1856 George had purchased a family burial plot I/366 at Woolwich Cemetery and they interred son John Pratt Roffey there (he had died aged 33 on 25 Aug). 3 years later George himself joined his son on 24 May 1859 (died 16 May), then his wife Maria 6 years after him, followed by daughter Maria Matilda in 1866, son James in 1898 and James' wife Annie the following year.
George Roffey 2 was the second son mentioned above, also see 22nd Sep 2014 -
In 1836 a George Roffey of his age was imprisoned one month for larceny. This may have been him, he was a Coal Merchant, maybe something with the books. Anyway he settled down by 1840 and married Jane Elizabeth Smith, daughter of a tobacconist neighbour of his father.
He tried at the bakery in Paradise Street, Rotherhithe, but was happier as a Rep. and sttled in Woolwich for some decades. However, when Jane died he moved to Islington, where he lived with his daughter Emily & family, then died in 1885 aged 66. He was buried in plot I/3/11482 at Islington Cemetery, 2nd of 9 interments over about 9 weeks.
George Thomas Roffey - see 22nd Sep 2014 & 12th Sep 2016 - grandson of George 2 above. No baptism, I am afraid.
He died in Jan 1934 and was buried in Hither Green Cemetery, plot U/Con/499, 10th interment of 15 buried over one month. When Emily died 12 years later, she went into another plot at the same cemetery with 19 others.
Harold Goodwin Roffey - see 7th Nov 2014 & 4th Oct 2016 -
No marriage scan I am afraid. When he died in Apr 1917 in Charlton, he was buried on 28 Apr in Charlton Cemetery. Ada remarried and when she died 33 years later it was in the same cemetery but a different plot.
Henry Edward Roffey son of George & Maria, and brother of George 2, was born, baptised, died and was buried all within 3 months in Woolwich.
both at St Mary Magdalene.
Sunday 28th April 2019
Ellen Hannah Roffey - see 14th Sep 2014 & 8th Sep 2016 - nothing new
Emily Roffey - see 15th Sep 2014 & 8th Sep 2016 - also nothing new
Emily Jane Roffey - see 18th Sep 2014 & 8th Sep 2016 - scans:
Emma Roffey - see 19th Sep 2014 - there is no baptism but marriage and death records have been scanned:
As far as I can see, there is no more. However, the Ancestry site is playing up, so I may well have to return at a later date...
Saturday 27th April 2019
Ellen Roffey - see 14th Sep 2014 - no baptism or marriage scans. She emigrated to USA in 1874 with 3 children and went on to have 10 more. I already went into detail in 2014 but amongst all the births and deaths I can now see she was committed to hospital in June 1880 for what was called "Melancholia". At that time she had 7 children, they were living in Oskaloosa, Mahaska, Iowa and looking closely at the census return, taken on 1st June, she was listed as "insane". The committal document is dated June, so she was probably admitted shortly after the census. There is a certain melancholy air in a photgraph taken around this time:
although others show her quite smiley, so it seems to have been a temporary thing. It wasn't a good time for her, as in June she was committed for 4 months, locked in at night, and while she was there her youngest daughter died aged 9 months. By the time the next census was due in 1890, she had given birth to 4 more children, but one died that year aged 6 and the next one also 3 years later. The 1890 census is largely (99%) missing, so they cannot be seen in the area they had just moved to, San Marcial, New Mexico (the US census taken that year was destroyed by fire). Frank was born there (child 11) in 1889 and Edith (no. 12) was born and died there (1890 & 1893) and her final child Arthur born there in 1895. I mentioned the disaster in this town in 2014, and can now bring you the timeline of this settlement:
1880s - the railway came and regenerated a settlement which had previously been here, but swept away by a flood in 1866. They should have learned a lesson, but didn't.
1917 - villages in the south of the town evacuated due to flooding
1920 - again flooded, much work done on flood defences
1929 - flooded again, entire area abandoned
Some tried again to resettle, but floods again only 1 month later led to the railway pulling out and the entire area remaining a wasteland.
So, when she died in August 1921 it was in San Martial and her death was registered there, but the family had already relocated to California the previous year, so she was buried in the family plot in Kern.
Tuesday 23rd April 2019
Edward John Roffey - see 11th Sep 2014
both at St Mary Magdalene.
Edward William Stansfield George Roffey - see 11th Sep 2014. I can't find a baptism for him and London marriage scans only go to 1932. So no new records. 1939 Register shows him with his mother Hannah and sister Ellen at 278 Woolwich Church Street. Gertrude was still at 56 Pendle Road, Wandsworth. working as a "National Machine Operator", which was evidently important war work (although not secret), as they had recently married (and she was listed under her married name). Over the next few years they were often apart, so it's no surprise they only had one child! When Edward died on 15 May 1979 he was cremated at Eltham Crematorium on 22 May and Gertrude moved to Wilton Lodge, a care home in Shenley, Radlett, Hertfordshire, she lived there for 28 years and died there on 20 May 2007.
Edwin Thomas Roffey - see 12th Sep 2014 for his adventures - and now I have scans:
Naval & Military Gazette Jul 1861
Eliza Roffey 1 - see 12th Sep 2014 - as I noted, she had no baptism or marriage. I do have a little more information re her burial. She was interred in plot T/158 at Woolwich Cemetery, the 8th and final incumbent, to join both her parents, several siblings and in-laws.
Eliza Roffey 2 - also see 12th Sep 2014 - scans:
When he died on 24 Jan 1925 he was buried on 29 Jan in plot Q/243 of Woolwich Cemetery, then she joined him on 30 May 1927, having died on 25th. They had the plot to themselves.
Elizabeth Roffey - see 7th Sep 2016 - a full set of scans:
both in St Margaret's, Plumstead, 11 years apart.
Elizabeth Mary Roffey - see 13th Sep 2014 & 8th Sep 2016 - for baptism scan see yesterday below.
I cannot find a scan for marriage. When John died he was buried on 19 Nov 1887 plot C3/AB/581 at Greenwich Cemetery with 4 others I don't know, but when Elizabeth died, she went into plot Q/243 with a Henry Thomas Hyam. It does seem odd that she couldn't join her husband, but that plot was filled and closed within a week, so maybe there was some contagion they were worried about.
Monday 22nd April 2019
Edward Charles Roffey Senior - see 8th Sep 2014 - scan of baptism with his sister:
but not his marriage, I am afraid. On 21 Sep 1906 Jessie died aged 71 and was buried in Greenwich Cemetery plot M/62 and Edward joined her there on 5 Feb 1912, having died on 30 Jan.
His son Edward Charles Roffey Junior - see 8th Sep 2014 & 6th Sep 2016 - I see that his army pension was paid to 16 Gloucester Road, Bristol (nowadays over a coffee shop) and in Jul 1938 he died there; I have a death record but I cannot find a burial record.
Edward James Roffey - see 21st Nov 2014 & 5th Oct 2016 - no baptism or marriage scan. As I said in 2016 he andhis wife Julia seem to have split up and were buried in different cemeteries; Edward in plot J/169 of Greenwich Cemetery on 20 Apr 1940 with 8 others, in later years topped up with 2 more. This was in wartime, so confusion may have caused him to be interred elsewhere, but I do believe he was living separately. When she died in 1951, Julia joined his family in plot E/Con/328 of Charlton Cemetery. His parents had been interred there in 1898 and 1904 and his siblings 1904-1931
Sunday 21st April 2019
Edward Roffey 3 - son of 2 yesterday - see 6th Sep 2014 - scan of baptism:
but none of marriage, I am afraid (despite being London in 1855). Nothing new until his burial -- see yesterday. After his death, Ann moved in with daughter Ann & family at 52 Etta Street, Deptford and can be seen with them in 1891 census "living on her own means" (i.e. savings/inheritance). When she died there later that year, she was buried locally, in Brockley Cemetery (plot K/Con/128), previously occupied by Clara Maria Boyler (who I cannot identify).
Saturday 20th April 2019
Ebenezer Roffey - see 1st Sep 2014 & 23rd Aug 2016 - 9th child of John & Sarah, brother of Charles below. He is still being elusive, born, living at home until in his 20s, trained as a blacksmith, then disappeared completely. In 2016 I suggested he changed his name. Electoral rolls don't help, as they all seem to just be for E Roffey and there are many Edwards.
Edith Annie Roffey - see 5th Sep 2014 - Cliff's grandmother. I have scans:
but nothing new.
Edward Roffey 1 - Cliff's 4xgreat grandfather - see 5th Sep 2014 - the only hint Ancestry has given me since is a marriage in 1854. But as almost nobody gets married at the age of 108 I shall disregard that. Besides, he died in 1779. Trying to trace him from such little information was difficult, for example from notes I made in the past, I knew he was born around 1747 but as he was the first Roffey in Woolwich, and I had a note ?Surrey, I searched the baptisms there. St Andrew's in Gatton gave me an Edward baptised on 19 Jun 1746, 7 days old, to a couple Richard and Jane Roffey. They had at least 6 other children baptised there 1734-43. Another couple Carew and Sarah Roffey had 10 children baptised in St John, Coulsdon, including an Edward on 3 Sep 1746. Sadly, there were several burials for both sets. I have a scan for the marriage:
Of course, they didn't have many children themselves as Edward died after only 8 years of marriage aged only 32.
His son Edward Roffey 2 was born 5 months after his father's death - see 5th Sep 2014 & 23rd Aug 2016 - scan of marriage is the only new document
He died in 1853 in Woolwich and Sarah in Sep 1857. When she was buried on 23 Sep 1857 it was in plot E/381 of Woolwich Cemetery. When I saw the details, I thought I had the wrong date of birth for Edward and he was in 1886 put in the same plot with her. But that would make him 105, and I realised it was their son Edward who lived with them in the 1850s. I shall deal with him tomorrow
Friday 19th April 2019
Charles Edward Roffey - see 1st Sep 2014 & 23rd Aug 2016. He was the father of Alfred & Arthur - see below, and son of Charles, studied on Friday. I have a baptism scan:
As I said in 2014, he went to sea for 4 years, then settled in Dublin in 1897 and established a business there. In 1911 census he can be seen boarding at 3 Sydenham Road, Dublin, with a William Hogan & family, as well as another boarder and 2 servants. This was the address I mentioned he gave as his residence in 1910.
3 Sydenham Road
In the Dublin directories he is seen with two entries, one with a business address of 9 Berg Quay, Dublin, and one with a home address of 9 Herbert Road, Ballsbridge. These addresses are 2 miles apart, so convenient. In the July quarter of 1914 in Dublin South he married Louisa Schomberg Howard and they had 2 daughters, Phyllis in 1916 and Florence in 1918.
9 Bergh Road, business address 1921, 1939 etc
Ireland did not compile a Register in 1939, as they were a neutral country. I have seen newspaper articles showing him to be a very respected member of the community; he was called as expert witness in 1923 and 1937 in cases of collision of ships. The other four times he appeared in the newspapers were at his death, which occurred on 6 Jan 1956 at 9 Herbert Road:
[similar houses nearby]
You can see from these photos that No 9 wasn't in quite as good condition as this, and was sold on his death in 1956
Louie, Phyllis & Chas 1930s
When he died he left effects worth £2543 to Rev. Sydney Craig, his son-in-law, living in Connecticut, USA (see Phyllis later).
Tuesday 16th April 2019
Ann Roffey was born on 30 Jun 1813 in Woolwich to Edward & Sarah née Loe and christened on 18 July at St Mary Magdalene,
On 9 Dec 1838 at St Nicholas, Deptford she married John Reilly, a local cheesemonger
He can be seen in Trade Directory of1839 running a business as cheesemonger at 10 Old Street, London and the following year they had a son James. All seemed well and they can be seen in 1841 census in High Street, Woolwich with baby James and a lady Bridget Reilly aged 69, who could be John's grandmother from Ireland, but in Jul 1849 at the age of 37 John died. She amy have married in 1851 but I cannot trace her, or she died in 1891 and was buried in Plumstead Cemetery. Suffice to say son James was away at school at the time of 1851 census, married in 1859, lived in Woolwich until he died there in 1883 aged 43. I have lost Ann, as I don't know her surname if she married.
Ann Sarah Jane Roffey - see 30th Aug 2014 - scans:
I have more details about their deaths. On 3 Jan 1931 at home in 52 Etta Street, Deptford Ann died aged 74, leaving £164 to Samuuel, and was buried on 9 Jan in Brockwell Cemetery. Then he died there on 29 Dec 1932 aged 88 and was buried alongside Ann on 3 Jan 1933, leaving effects worth £386 to Harry Samuel Scott, crane driver. As they had no children Harry was no doubt a friend.
Arthur Eldridge Roffey - see 22nd Aug 2016 - I have not found a baptism, or his first marriage (to Lucy Neale in West Ham, where she lived) but have a scan of his second:
They had both been married before, and 7 children between them. When Arthur died he was buried on 24 Sep in Charlton Cemetery plot Q/926, where he was joined on 14 Apr 1955 by stepson Thomas Spooner. As I said, Florence retired to Worthing and died there.
Back to the Cheshire branch for the next one. Arthur George Roffey - see 31st Aug 2014 - and Alfred below for early years. I have just found a baptism, on 22 May 1875 at St Paul, Birkenhead, along wit a brother I knew nothing about! He had a little brother Herbert Wheeler Roffey, born 2 years after him and unfortunately died 2 years later.
Please see the entry in 2014, as I followed his movements in detail there. I have seen the Naturalization papers I referred to, assuming he was succesful, and can see now that he was. The document won't paste here though, as it is too big and the writing faint and small. I was glad to see he passed, unlike the one previous in the file, who was not admitted due to "lack of intelligence"! I cannot see any children, and they settled in Richmond, New York, where he died on 25 Apr 1948 aged 77.
His father Charles Roffey was the ancester who linked Woolwich with Birkenhead, born in the former and moving to the latter as an adult.
I included all details in 2014, and there are no new scans except this Will:
I hope you can see it. The writing in itself is worth a look.
Charles Alfred Roffey - see 24th Nov 2014 & 5th Oct 2016 - nothing new except the plot number in Charlton Cemetery is S/104 and both Charles (buried 17 Jun 1926) and Lucy (2 Oct 1967) were interred there .
Monday 15th April 2019
Alfred Clarence Roffey - see 28th Aug 2014 & 22nd Aug 2016 -
The other new documents are a couple of electoral rolls showing that in 1911 and 1915 he was living at 48 Falkland Road, Egremont, Birkenhead (same as 1911 census), renting a 1st-floor bedroom and use of the rest of the house from his father Charles, who lived at the same address at that point. When his father died the following year (1916) the home address was 19 Clarendon Road, and Alfred lived there until his death in 1960
Incidentally, the redacted line in 1939 Register that I suggested was Gordon is still closed, so nobody has pointed out his death to Findmypast. The other line (below Annie) has been opened and it is next door, so not relevant.
Alfred Leonard Roffey - see same dates - scans:
I think Alice died on 31 May 1968 aged 87 and was buried in Geelong, Victoria, but I cannot find a death for Alfred. Oh, I have seen an Army record for WW1; he signed up for the Australian forces in 1918, having been in UK Army before emigrating, but failed the medical due to "defective vision" (although passed for "non-combatant duties"). Considering his children, Leonard died in infancy, Elsie aged 4 just after they emigrated, Frank married local girl Lily Victoria (Lyn) Nation and died aged 43.
Alfred Stanfield Roffey - see 29th Aug 2014 - I still cannot find a baptism, but know they already lived at the bakery, 100 High Street. Please take the time to read through the section on the Woolwich area I included on 30th Aug 2014. The family ran two bakeries in the area; 100 High Street and 29 Coleman Street. It's a shame there are no old photos of the New Steam Packet pub as it was next door. There are no scans of their marriage, unfortunately. Alfred died aged 57 on 15 Feb 1934 and was buried in Woolwich Cemetery, plot 8/294, leaving effects worth £415 to Hannah. She remarried in 1947 to Charles Rolfe, who died in 1961, then she did on 6 Oct 1981, joining Alfred in his plot the next day. She left £25,000.
Sunday 14th April 2019
Cliff's uncle Manlius William Smith - see 28th Aug 2014 & 22nd Aug 2016
When I studied him before I despaired at his putting aside of his rare first name in adulthood in favour of his mundane and very frequent middle name. However, the Army does not do this, fortunately, so his wartime papers since released have enabled me to find him easily. I stated that he was in "the 23rd London Regiment Territorial Force then the 2nd London Regiment, being discharged as a corporal with 2 medals". Strictly speaking he was not "discharged" as he was taken Prisoner of War in Germany and died in captivity on 17 Jul 1918.
There is a stone at plot VC11 in the cemetery at Stahnsdorf, 22k SW of Berlin:
In case you can't see the inscription, it says "245017 Corporal Manlius William Smith 2nd Bn London Regt Royal Fusiliers 17th July 1918 Age 20. Of Battersea".
His sister Ruth Isabella Smith (Sis) - see 28th Aug 2014 & 22nd Aug 2016
I am most confused about the 1939 Register. I have found her, by searching for Ruth Loder, one of her housemates, and found them... at 124 Stewarts Road, Battersea! There must be 2 records for this! As expected, she was with Ruth Loder (née Roffey), her widowed maternal aunt, and Richard & Edith Stanbridge, her cousin, also a closed file, probably one of their children. As I said before, she lived at Huron Road with them for some years. Electoral Roll records now extend further, but I can't be sure which is her. Anyway, I am pretty sure the death in 1973 is her, as they used the middle name and correct date of birth. Surrey Mid-Eastern included Sutton as well as Coulsdon, Dorking and several more areas.
The end of the Smiths ushers in the branch relating to the mother of these final two; Edith Roffey, Cliff's grandmother.
Saturday 13th April 2019
Herbert Henry Smith Junior was son of Senior I dealt with yesterday. See 17th Aug 2014 & 21st Aug 2016. Calling your children after yourself is good and bad news for a genealogist, and here is a case in point. Yesterday I attached the WW1 army record to HHS Senior, but it was Junior it relates to. It didn't help me that they lived at the same address and both worked on the railways, albeit different fields; Senior was a boiler rivetter, Junior a porter/guard. I have double-checked and the summary I posted yesterday matches up with the pension documents of Junior, and the Next Of Kin is Edith (this would be the case for both), marked Mother. After marriage he is the HH with Daisy, living at 25 Hartington Road, Kennington at first (medals sent there) then 98 Prince's Road (later part of Black Prince Road) until at least 1926. Scans:
After this they moved to Croydon, 1939 Register is confusing as Herbert appears with a Winifred Frances Smith and an Ada, and I don't know who these are, unless they are daughters I know nothing about. Daisy appeared to be in Camberwell with a couple of other Smiths, but she is of an age with the married one, so it is probably some other family entirely. I have two deaths in the Croydon area which suit her; 1960 and 1966. Herbert died on 19Jan 1972 at 114 Croham Valley Road, leaving £2166.
Great great grandmother Jane Smith - see 18th Aug 2014 & 21st Aug 2016 - it has just struck me that both her mother and her husband's mother were called Mary Hayward, I certainly hope they weren't the same lady; the dates of birth are very similar! Mind you, I suppose even if this were so, they had no children... No new records, although the Criminal Records show a John Hutchings got 6 months for forgery in Exeter and a Jane Woodman 3 months for "breaking buildings... and dealing". I'm not sure what the latter means, but I can't prove these are "ours" anyway. There was also a James Woodman in 1867 tried for "riotously injuring property", but the case was dropped. Exeter is/was not a huge city, so these are likely, in which case she mixed with a bad crowd.
Her brother John James Smith - see 21st Aug 2016 - was the third John Smith, whose records fell into place when I last studied him. The only new document I can find though, is a naval career covering 4 ships over 14 years, as a cook. But I have nothing to prove it was him and Devon is not mentioned at all...
The plain John Smith - see 22nd Aug 2014 - was father of John James & Jane above and I still cannot decide on his baptism or death, as there are just too many!
John Sidney Smith was very odd, born 13 Nov 1834 in Sidmouth, Devon to John James & Mary Ann, baptised in Bombay, India and possibly enlisting as a sailor in Baltimore for 6 months and dying aged 90 in Philadelphia. Or, more likely, marrying a Sarah also from Devon, settling in London, working as a "Master Batler", employing 2 men - he trained as a stonemason in his teen years. It is all very confusing with a name so common.
Friday 12th April 2019
Henry Smith Cliff's great grandfather - see 16th Aug 2014 & 20th Aug 2016 - nothing new. I still can't find his whereabouts in 1841 and his wife's maiden name. I have located a possible death for her; at the London County Lunatic Asylum, Ilford, buried on 15th Apr 1895, but I cannot prove this. I only know that by 1901 Henry was widowed and living with his son, then died himself in 1910, possibly the one buried in Woolwich Cemetery on 25 October, died 14 Oct,
His son Henry Smith 2 - see 17th Aug 2014 - scans:
(sorry if you cannot see details clearly. they evidently were in need of blotting paper in 1892 at All Saints)
I may have found burials for his first wife Georgina 28 Oct 1903 in Nunhead Cemetery (with 22 others in the plot), his second wife Emily 5 Dec 1924 in Ladywell Cemetery, Lewisham, and he joined her in Ladywell 27 Nov 1933 (in a different plot).
Henry William Smith - see 17th Aug 2014 - always called William, baptised with his sister Charlotte when aged 2:
He never married as he died aged 21. There are several possibilities for burials in Norwood and in Lewisham.
Herbert Henry Smith Senior, brother of the above and Cliff's grandfather. - see 17th Aug 2014 -
baptism with sister Ellen
As before, I cannot track him down towards the end of his life. Edith died in 1936 but it is very difficult to follow him. There were at least 3 other Herbert Henry Smiths (apart from his son) in the Lambeth/Wandsworth area. One, in WW1 roll, was definitely him
but I cannot trace him afterwards, and he doesn't appear to be on 1939 Register. There is a Fire Watcher H H Smith inscribed on the Civilian War Dead memorial at the Lambeth Cemetery Tooting, who died in the course of his duties on 3 Aug 1944, but I don't know if this was him. I do know that 124 Stewart's Road, Battersea did not contain anyone called Smith in 1939, so if he was still around he didn't live there.
Tuesday 9th April 2019
Eric Benjamin Smith Cliff's uncle - see 15th Aug 2016 -
15 Apr 1912 Christ Church, Clapham
Unfortunately, although I thought I had found his death it was wrong, as he was last seen in 1939 in Tooting, so could not have died in 1931. Daughter Jennifer was born in 1942, but as that was in Watford it was no help. I fear I must give up again as there are, as you can imagine, many many records in the names of Eric and Florence Smith. Even Jennifer...
Grandpa Ernest Sidney Smith - see 15th Aug both 2014 & 2016 -
As I have said before, the scanned London marriages oonly goes to 1932, this date is 1933, so no scan
This is from the El Alamein memorial roll, which runs to 7368 names in WW2 alone. He was buried in plot XIII c16
this is a photo dated a few days before, on 27 Oct
Gladys Smith - see 15th Aug 2014,16th Aug 2016 and Friday below.
No marriage scan because it was in Essex. I said Frederick was a widower, I now suspect he had 4 children. He married Ethel Lobley in 1907, lived in Ilford until she died in 1926, running a business as a fishmonger. He died in 1934, so as I said she was a widow in the Register. The closed Outten was probably their only child Phyllis. I still cannot track down the death record, but there are many mis-spellings of his name. Gladys died in 1957 in Romford.
Friday 5th April 2019
Edwin Smith - see 14th Aug 2014 - it is the censuses that give birth areas of him & his siblings, but he seems to have slipped through the net, as the 2 oldest & 2 youngest siblings were baptised, but not him. As I suggested in 2014, he may have been registered & baptised with another name; there were a lot of Smiths in Potterspury in 1855 but with no parents' names, so that is no help. And I suspect that after his mother died and his father went to live with Herbert and family, he lived elsewhere under another name - and died so - and thus I have to drop this file again.
His sister Ellen Smith - also see 14th Aug 2014 - was baptised on 29 Jun 1882 at St Augustine's Mission Church aged 6 with her brother Herbert
[one of the first baptisms with this name, previously St James, Bermondsey]
She died aged 19, and was buried on 24 Oct 1896 in p;lot 83/27105 at the Lambeth Cemetery, West Norwood. In May 1898 she was joined by John S Smith, her grandmother Jane's nephew.
Ellen Smith 2 - see also 14th Aug 2014 - and 15th Aug 2016, where I thought I disproved my previous work! I see from my notes that I have since found a marriage in 1920 in Orsett, Essex and a matching 1939 Register, so will go with those. Baptism scan:
She joined the Infants of Larkhall Lane School on 7 Oct 1895, giving home address of 25 Clifton Street, Larkhall Lane, beside the park, then the Juniors on 29 Mar 1897, when they were living along the other side of the park at 31 Courland Grove (now modern buildings, as the park was redeveloped in 1943 and again recently)
As I said, she was a visitor in 1911 census, in Newington, listed as a domestic servant. Then in Jul 1920 in Orsett, Essex she married George Edward Wilks, Essex born & bred, and settled there with him. They had 3 children and in 1939 Register can be seen at 32 Hall Avenue, Aveley with them.
Also at this address was widowed invalid Gladys Outten, Ellen's sister and another, closed file (not Daisy, as she was with her family in Yeovil - see below). Arthur is the only child unredacted as Rose is no doubt still alive, he died in 1995 (George died in 1942 but it was at sea, so remains hidden). George was listed as "Alum Attendant"/Cement Works Labourer and Ellen UDD. They evidently remained living in the same house for another 20 years at least, as George died in Oldchurch Hospital in 1956 with this home address, and Ellen at home in 1961. She left £544 to son Arthur, an electrician's mate.
Tuesday 2nd April 2019
Victor William Hodd - see 12th Aug 2016 - nothing new
Violet Josephine Hodd - see 7th Aug 2014 & 13th Aug 2016 - scans:
No more, I'm afraid.
The 3 generations of William Hodd - see 8th Aug 2014 & 13th Aug 2016 - William Senior was toll-collector on the Isle of Wight and his story was told in great detail. Nothing new. His son William Robert Hodd likewise and grandson William George Hodd too.
So, on to the Smiths, Cliff's father's people.
Anthony Smith - see 11th Aug 2014 & 14th Aug 2016 - Cliff's 3xgreat uncle, whose story is mainly of court cases and time spent in prison. Unfortunately, Devon is not well-served with scans, details etc so the western branches of this tree may be devoid of news.
Anthony Gordon Smith, Cliff's uncle Tony - see 15th Aug 2016 - despite being born in London, he was too recent for scans. One of the redacted lines on 1939 Register has been opened, but is an Ivy Benney insurance clerk. The other line may be him, still closed.
Charlotte Emily Smith, a great-aunt - see 11th Aug 2014 & 15th Aug 2016 - died aged almost 3 but managed a baptism scan:
I cannot tell where she was buried as there were three possibilities that year with her name.
Daisy Olive Smith - see same dates - I can bring you a scan of her baptism:
but the London marriage scans stop at present in 1921, hers was 1923. And no Burge burials in Somerset.
Monday 1st April 2019
Thomas Henry Hodd - another great-uncle - see 4th Aug 2014 & 9th Aug 2016 - no baptism but marriage scan:
nothing else new.
Thomas Henry Hodd 2 - see same dates - I can now see he was baptised aged 2 with his cousin Albert Head, at Christ church, Deptford.
His mother had died the previous year and he and his father lived with his grandparents for a while, then his aunt Caroline, at this point, until she died the following year. By 1885 his father was also gone and in 1891 he was lodging with what could have been a friend/workmate of his father, who may also have apprenticed him, in Sussex. By 1901 he was back in Croydon, training up as a bricklayer and settled there after marriage.
In 2016 I found Florence but couldn't track him down in 1939 Register, but think I may have him, also in Croydon half a mile away at 151 Queen's Road, working as a builder's labourer and acting as ARP for his employer
Florence died in Croydon in 1958 and Thomas followed in 1965.
His father Thomas Stephen Hodd - see 7th Aug 2014 & 12th Aug 2016 - scans:
[his parents must have dropped their Hs to be recorded as Odd]
Annie died in 1881 and Thomas in 1885, both in the Croydon area.
Sunday 31st March 2019
Stephen James Hodd - see 1st Aug 2014 - there are now several documents relating to military service and his final days. I see from medical notes that he was treated by army medics at the 189th Field Ambulance hospital in France for scabies (no doubt due to the poor conditions) and discharged back to the trenches on 23 Aug 1916, then reported Missing In Action 2 weeks later. He was awarded 2 medals and commemmorated on the Thiepval Memorial when it was built in memory of the thousands who met their end here. He was 26 years old with 9 months service, 3 of these in the field, and the medals and his effects sent home to his father in London.
[this last picture was of wreaths laid at the memorial in 1 Jul 2016 the centenary]
Hs father Stephen Richard Hodd, Cliff's great-uncle - also see 1st Aug 2014 - there is no baptism record, as expected, but here is scan of marriage:
As you can see, both fathers were deceased and both bride and groom were illiterate (strange for an "optician"; I think the description on the census was more accurate in that he was a manual worker, planing lenses, rather than an optician himself. If you'll excuse the pun, he was on the cutting edge of this technology, as the planar lens was only created by Zeiss in 1896 for photography and Stephen no doubt worked for Dollond's company in Kennington). No burial records are around, unfortunately.
Susan Hodd - see 3rd Aug 2014 - another great-aunt, one of the married sisters who were baptised after their mother died:
The previous year she had married her next-door neighbour George Dodge:
and moved to Fulham with him. When she died aged 56 in 1916 George married her sister Elizabeth. I have continued looking for his railway employment records, but the George Dodge I found was 2 years younger than him and was based in Wiltshire. His death was registered in Croydon - see Elizabeth below.
Thomas George Hodd - see 3rd Aug 2014 & 9th Aug 2016 - baptism scan aged 10:
But nothing else.
Tuesday 26th March 2019
Cliff's great-aunt Mary Ann Priscilla Hodd - see 28th July 2014 & 7th Aug 2016 - baptism scan:
She was one of the daughters who were baptised after they were married with their sister Elizabeth (see below). She was 24 and had already had 4 of her own children baptised. I think they waited until their mother died as they didn't want to upset her. Marriage scan:
When it came to the end of her life, I was dismayed in 2016 to find her not with Ada and Charles in 1939 Register, but now I can see the scan more clearly, I see she was there (under some tape) as widow "Margery" Freeman, date of birth 3 Sep 1957, UDD. So I will revert to her death in 1944, and can see that in plot 48/33262 in West Nrwood Cemetery there are 4 occupants. On 27 Apr 1912 Henry was interred, followed by Mary Ann on 28 Feb 1944, Charles on 20 Dec 1957 and Ada 2 Aug 1961. (The only death I can match up with that date for Henry is in Stockport, Cheshire. Why he was there I don't know, but otherwise he was buried 7 years before he died, which is never a good thing!)
Matilda Hodd - see 28th July 2014 & 7th Aug 2016 - oneof the siblings baptised in 1889, when she was 3:
and the daughter I suspect had an illegitimate baby and passed her off as her sister, so she didn't lose her job at the Savoy. Of course, there is no documentation to back this up. Her marriage scan:
When it comes to the 1939 Register, now one of the redacted lines has been opened and had produced a surprise - a son Richard I knew nothing about! He slotted in between James and Sarah, went on to marry an Eileen Deeley and as far as I can see is still living in Croydon. (The other redacted line is a little odd, as it is 1st in the household of Matilda & Thomas Brewer, so maybe is one of his parents). James died just before the Register, aged 49 and Matilda on 5 Feb 1966 aged 79. I cannot find burial details on either, unfortunately.
Matilda Hodd 2 - see 28th July 2014 & 7th Aug 2016 - nothing new, including scans
Richard Hodd Junior - see 31st July 2014 & 8th Aug 2016 - from Kent, father of Matilda 2, Mary Ann etc. I told the story of his life in detail, especially his end. Nothing new.
Richard Hodd Senior - see 8th Aug 2016 - putting together the bits & pieces in his history, I can say he was born in the Woking area of Surrey on 26 Jun 1791 to James & Susanna, and baptised at the nearby Independent Chapel, Shackleford Tything on 22 Jan 1792. On 7 May 1812 in the Tonbridge area of Kent he married Priscilla Clarke from Bidborogh. This was by licence as they were both aged 20, so "under age". They settled in Kent, but Richard Sr died in Dec 1816 aged only 27. His son Richard Jr was born the following year and you can read the rest of the story elsewhere. Suffice to say, the difficulties of his childhood with no father may have compounded the medical condition mentioned... Priscilla died in 1841.
In researching this branch I have discovered many more relatives, but as this is only a branch of "in-laws", i.e. only related to Cliff by marriage, I will go no further. It turns out that Richard was one of possibly 12 children, and each of those will spawn a tree. Suffice to say his parents were James Hodd 1747-1830 and Susanna née Clayton 1756-1834 both from Woking.
Great-uncle Richard Stephen Hodd - see 31st July 2014 & 8th Aug 2016 where I told his story in detail. I now have a marriage scan:
As for burial details, I told about the plot at Merton yesterday and Saturday.
Monday 25th March 2019
Laura Esther Hodd - see 20th July 2014 & 3rd Aug 2016 -
As she never married there is no scan for that, but I now know she died on 21 Mar 1980 at 6 Woodstock Road, Carshalton and was buried in the Family Plot in Church Road Cemetery, Merton to join sister Florence and their parents (see Saturday below) on 18 Apr 1980. She must have moved to Carshalton in her final decade, as electoral roll records place her still at Elgin Road in 1970 with brother Henry. She probably moved in 1974 when he died.
6 Woodstock Road
Lily Florence Hodd - see 21st July 2014 - for baptism scan see Ernest William below (on Friday). She is really confusing, as I found in 2016 and had to give up. The same applies today; I don't believe the marriage I found to Ernest Sweeney in 1915 is correct, as the date of birth in 1939 Register (Leatherhead) is completely wrong. However, the one with the right date of birth to Charles Powell is hiding from me, unless her name was Mallett.This marriage says she was a spinster, and there are Malletts living with them in 1939, so it is confusing.
Cliff's grandmother Martha Hodd - see 24th July 2014 -
There was no baptism records for any of this family and they were fortunate enough to not lose any in infancy.
When John died in 1905 she moved around a bit; in 1910 4 Albert Buildings, Lollard Street, in 1915 at 2 Wickham Street (right behind Vauxhall Street School) but by 1918 she had settled in 18 Princes Square and remained there until she died 20 years later.
I have studied the history of this house in a little detail, one day I will do so in more depth. In 1913-15 they lived there under the name of William, the eldest boy, who was then 29, but he put it in his mother's name when he left to join the Army in 1916. Built in 1788, the terraces face onto a square with gardens, named Prince's Square after Joseph Prince, then in 1937 renamed Cleaver Square after Mary Cleaver, who had owned the land in the 18th Century. These buildings are all still standing and are listed, so will continue to do so. Clifford was born there and his mother Ethel brought up the boys there until they moved around to Kennington Park Road after Ernest was killed.
Martha Eliza Hodd - see 25th July 2014 - from the branch I called the "Kent Hodds", she links trees by marrying Cliff's great-uncle Joseph.
For scan of marriage see Joseph Junior yesterday below. I have updated my thoughts on her "surprise" in 1903, as you know, believing now that Edith was not her daughter, as was claimed, but that of her daughter, Matilda, who was at that time a 17-year-old servant working at The Savoy. Other than that, she lived in the Vauxhall area until she died there on 5 Jun 1916. I can't find anything relating to her death except the registration.
Her eldest sister, Mary Ann Hodd - see 25th July 2014 & 7th Aug 2016 - where I told her story in detail. I can't find a scan of her baptism, as this was in rural Kent, but here is her marriage:
I told how she was a school mistress but they had money troubles and she took up dressmaking, although this did not suffice and David died in the workhouse in 1891. Mary Ann's death was registered in the West Ham registration area, which may mean she had to resort to the workhouse herself, or remained in Plaistow, where she llived, which was also part of the West Ham area.
Sunday 24th March 2019
Henry William Hodd - see 12th July 2014 & 1st Aug 2016 -
I have a few updates: the closed file in 1939 Register has been opened and it turns out to be the next house, so is not relevant here. I can trace Henry & Ellen by electoral rolls 1919 & 1920 with her parents at Block T Peabody Square, then on their own 1921-1938 in Block A 1939-1945 (war years) he ran the Myddleton Arms, Islington, then 1945-1962 The Garland in Redhill. He retired then, and as I said in 2016, went to live with sister Laura in Sutton. I see now that he died there on 26 Feb 1974, leaving £986, presumably to her.
James Joseph Hodd - see 14th July 2014 & 2nd Aug 2016 -
no marriage scan, unfortunately, no changes on 1939 Register, and no further death info.
Jean Violet Hodd - see 2nd Aug 2016 - no new information except that her husband Bryan Catchpole was a 5-year-old patient in North-Western Hospital, Hampstead at the time of the 1939 Register (originally a smallpox hospital, it had by then become a general hospitl and later became part of the Royal Free).
Joan Iris Hodd - also see 2nd Aug 2016 - I had wondered why they lived in Durham and had their children there, but now know that John came from that city. Apparently this is John and Joan:
The same fellow genealogist says that John died in 2004 in Isle Of Wight, but has no date for Joan. She is still redacted on the 1939 Register so may be still around.
Job James Hodd - see 14th July 2014 & 3rd Aug 2016 -
Nothing else new.
Joseph Hodd Senior - see 18th July 2014 & 3rd Aug 2016 - was rather confusing and I got rather tangled up. I think, coming back to it now, that it is much simpler, they never went to Croydon and he died in Lambeth in 1883 ony 2 years after Susan. Although Ancestry don't seem to have the record, I have found it on Findmypast, although no further info.
Joseph Hodd Junior, his eldest son - see 18th July 2014 & 3rd Aug 2016 - all I have is scan of his marriage, and if I am correct, his father died only a matter of weeks later
I have no scans for baptism or details of burial, I am afraid. Hodd is unfortunately misspelled frequently..
Saturday 23rd March 2019
Florence Louise Hodd - see 10th July 2014 & 30th July 2016 - scans:
That's all really.
Florence Rose Hodd - see 31st July 2016 - as she died aged 17 there isn't a lot on her, but I can now bring you her baptism scan:
and a lot of useful details around her death. As I said in 2016 she died aged 17 while living at 7 St Mary's Square, and I now see that she was buried at Church Road Cemetery, Merton, Surrey in plot Q89, where an Ethel Blogg had been interred 2 years before. I don't know this lady, but she may be family as all of the others in this plot were. After Florence was buried there on 23 Nov 1918, her parents joined her after 25 and 41 years, then her youngest sister Laura in 1980.
Church Road Cemetery/St Peter & St Paul
(dates from 1559 with records from 1883)
Frederick William Hodd - see 10th July 2014 & 31st July 2016 - for baptism scan see yesterday, below, as he was baptised with brothers Ernest and George. I told his story in 2014 until he vanished in 1953 and suggested maybe he left his family. I think I have now found his death record - misspelled "Hood" and registered across the river in Chelsea, but it fits. He was buried on 6 Mar 1952, the 4th of 8 burials in plot 33/31005 in Camberwell Old Cemetery (buried over 11 days). Winifred died on 16 May 1974 in Lambeth and was cremated at the crematorium in Tooting on 24 May.
George Hodd hasn't been mentioned before, as he was born in Apr 1848 in Cudham to Richard & Matilda née Saunders, baptised 14 June 1848 and died there in Apr 1851 aged 3. Just prior to his death he was seen in 1851 census at Leaves Green, Cudham with parents and sister Amy (who also died, only 6 days later) - see 17th March below.
George Henry Hodd - see 11th July 2014 & 31st July 2016 - brother of Frederick above, so see the joint baptism below. No scan of marriage as it was in Norfolk and quite recent. I also cannot track down a burial record for George in 1984 and Annie in 1987.
Gerald Richard Hodd - see 11th July 2014 & 31st July 2016 - nothing new
Friday 22nd March 2019
Ernest George Hodd - I haven't mentioned him before as he died aged 11, but I now have a scan of his baptism, which took place on 15 Aug 1906, when he was 8 years ald, with two of his brothers
He can also be seen in census of 1901 aged 3 at 30 Doris Street with parents & sibs. He died in the October quarter of 1909 but I don't know if/when/where he was buried
Ernest William Hodd - see 7th July 2014 & 27th July 2016 - I have told how he was baptised twice, one aged 8 months at St John's, Croydon:
I'm still not sure why Croydon, as his parents had lived there but no longer did. They moved to Lambeth in 1885, but maybe they had loyalties/connections to their old church. He was also baptised with sister Lily at the age of 5 at St Mary the Less, Lambeth
I cannot find a scan of his first marriage to Lydia, or of Lydia's death, but records do exist to confirm these events. Equally, I have found Rosa's death record, but no scan (mind you it was 1971 so too recent for this)
Tuesday 19th March 2019
Elizabeth Hodd - see 3rd July 2014 - scans:
From the late 1880s they lived at 33 Great Guildford Street, Southwark, part of a warehouse building he rented from Truman Hanbury & Co, the brewers. In 1922 Alfred died, the tax was totted up and Elizabeth moved out to Dulwich. As Alfred died in the Dulwich property, it looks as though they had already moved, probably in 1920 on his retirement (he was a porter/warehouseman, so maybe Truman were his employers).
He was buried in plot 37/27188 in Camberwell Old Cemetery on 13 Mar 1922 and Elizabeth joined him in the plot on 10 Jan 1938.
Elizabeth M Hodd - (Cliff's great-aunt) see 4th July 2014 & 27th July 2016 - I still cannot find a baptism for her; and this will be the case for all of her siblings, I suspect. I know the family lived in the parish of St Mary Newington [a photo I took from the bar opposite in 2014]
In 2014 I outlined the family movements around Kennington.
Later: I have found a baptism for 3 of the siblings! Evidently Joseph & Susan did not believe, so none of their babies were christened. On 1 Aug 1882 Mary Ann, Susan & Elizabeth all underwent Adult Baptism at Emmanuel church (on John Street/Gundulf Street, where they were living), aged 24, 22 & 16 respectively. Two of the three were already married but their mother had recently died and their father the following year.
Elizabeth took jobs as servant in Brixton & Clapham, then when her sister Susan died in 1916 she married the widower George Dodge and had 13 years with him in Fulham then after about 1925 in Croydon, where he died in 1929. Elizabeth was resident at 180 Kingston Road, Merton, which I think may have been a nursing home then, when she died on 23 Oct 1952 and buried on 29 Oct in plot K/387 in Garth Road Cemetery. Six other people were put in that plot over the next few weeks, but I can't find George at all.
She left effects worth £123 to Ada Bennett, who I see now is her niece, sister Mary Ann's daughter.
Another great-aunt Ellen Hodd - see 6th July 2014 & 27th July 2016 - sister of Elizabeth above. She also was baptised as an adult, this time on 25 Mar 1882 at St Alphege, Southwark aged 27. This was a few months before her sisters, also just after the death of their mother. (Ellen had by then a daughter of her own, who had been baptised at the same church 3 years earlier, and she was expecting her second).
[to the chap I called William John May 2 on Saturday]
Monday 18th March 2019
Audrey D Hodd - see 23rd July 2016 - I thought I had found a death record and burial for her husband Anthony Robinson, but he turned up in electoral roll records of 2003, so his is probably the death in 2011 and Audrey is still living aged 75.
Caroline Hodd - see 30th June 2014 & 26th July 2016 - scans:
I managed to sort out the confusion by 2016, so no difficulty now. Unfortunately she was only 27 when she died, I suspect from difficulties in childbirth, although I cannot see any child who survived to baptism. As I said, Henry went on to remarry but he did join her in this cemetery when he died in 1918 (Brockley Cemetery). Caroline was interred into plot V/Uncon/233 but Henry a different plot as it was 34 years later.
Daisy Maud Hodd - see 3rd July 2014 & 26th July 2016 - scans:
admission aged 4 to Walnut Tree Walk School
baptism aged 6
I now know why I couldn't find her in 1939 Register; she died in Jan 1934 in Lewisham aged 46 and was buried there on1 Feb in Ladywell Cemetery with son Kenneth, who had died aged 2 in 1928. Alfred remarried early in 1939, so can be seen in the Register, taken in September, at 32 Playgreen Way, Lewisham, with new wife Florence née Kinnaird. The previous year he had been working as a Postman, but now was listed as Lavatory Attendant. Mind you, I can see how he could be doing both of those jobs at the same time... He died in 1961 aged 72 and was cremated at Hither Green, Florence the same in 1975 and their ashes are together there.
Derek W Hodd - see 3rd July 2014 & 26th July 2016 - son of Athur I dealt with yesterday - nothing new.
Edith Hodd - see 26th July 2016 - in 1911 they were still pretending she was Martha's child and she was baptised as such (although I wonder how they explained Joseph's absence)
In the census taken a few weeks later they were indeed at 124 Tyers Street but Martha admitting to being a widow. The church where Edith was married in 1924 was St Cosmus, Blean (near Canterbury) and very lovely:
There are no further scans, as these records are too recent, but I can say that since I wrote in 2016, youngest son Albert must have died, as his redaction in 1939 Register has been removed.
Victor & Edith evidently lived in Kent all their lives, near members of my family again, through to their deaths in Canterbury in 1978 (Victor) and 1982 (Edith).
Sunday 17th March 2019
As you are aware, the Mays are inextricably linked with the Hodds, so I always move on to them next.
Agnes V Hodd - see 16th Jul 2016 - nothing new, despite a long search for her death (in my database programme I have a note "died 1971 in Lambeth" but I can't find a record and I don't know where that information came from).
Albert Victor Hodd - see 26th June 2014 & 19th July 2016 -
He was baptised on 26 Oct 1898 with brother William, who died very soon afterwards unfortunately. No scan of marriage as it took place in Lincolnshire, not covered by Ancestry. Likewise burial, although this occurred in London. Edith died at 157 Hyde Tower, Regency Street, London on 14 Jul 1974, leaving £469, presumably to Albert, who died at the very end of 1978. I suspect he was cremated at Manor Park on 29 Dec 1978 and his death was registered in the New Year in the Westminster registration area.
Alfred William Burgess Hodd - see 19th July 2016 - Cliff's second cousin, who lived so close to Lollard Place (as I said in 2016 "little did I know when I stayed with my grandparents in the early '60s only a couple of streets away that my future husband's relatives were so close") 1949-1962 in Doris Street. Then in 1964 they (he and his mother) can be seen at 18 Malmsey House, Vauxhall Street (where my mother went to school) and this was where his mother died in 1974 and was cremated at Lambeth Crematorium in Tooting. Alfred remained there for a while, but electoral roll records then stop until his death on 8 Dec 1989, registered in the Greenwich registration area, and he was cremated on 28 Dec that year at Eltham Crematorium, which is incidentally where my father was cremated and his ashes were interred in 1986.
Amy Hodd didn't last long but managed to generate some records, although unfortunately not scans. She was born in June 1850 in Leaves Green, Cudham, Kent and baptised there on 14 July
St Peter & Paul church Cudham
The following March the 1851 census was taken and she can be seen at Leaves Green with her parents and brother. Unfortunately she died a few weeks later aged just a year and was buried, probably in the churchyard above.
Arthur Augustus Hodd - see 30th Jun 2014 & 23rd July 2016 - brother of Albert above.
There is no scan for the marriage, even though Surrey records ostensibly go to 1933. I still have no luck in sorting out the children either. Arthur died at 32 Grant Road, Addiscombe (where he had lived for at least 30 years) aged 69 and left £1175. Dorothy had gone in 1947, aged only 38.
Saturday 16th March 2019
William John May 1 - Cliff's Uncle Bill - see 23rd Jun 2014 & 11th July 2016 - I have tracked down his baptism and it tallies with the dob he gave in 1939, so that's good!
I can't find a nice scan of the troublesome marriage in 1939, as Ancestry London marriages stop at 1932. I think what happened was (and of course I may be wrong) Jane Belsham changed her name on the run-up to WW2, but when Bill found he had married a girl with a false name, he married her again in 1941 under her real one. The government found out about this in 1949, so added the note to the Register. Maybe the other Stella was her sister, as she was at the same address in 1939. Anyway, it was all sorted except that I couldn't find a death in either name, or even (as it turns out) for Bill - the death I favoured for him turned out to be a baby. I wish I could ask Cliff if he knew where his uncle died, and when. He was last seen in my records at 76 Worham Road, Hornsey in 1965, but the only cremations I can find around that time in London were both in Lambeth. There were several cemeteries within a couple of miles of that address
William John May 2 was his uncle - see 23rd Jun 2014 - twin of John
I know that he died on 20 Dec 1890 aged 35 at 14 Market Street, Southwark, as I have his death certificate. The nearest burial I can find is 4 Dec 1891 in Brompton, which is not feasible. I can't find a burial for Ellen, although I do know that she died in Jul 1919 probably in Goda Street, where she was living with daughter Rosina, registered in Southwark.
Friday 15th March 2019
Thomas William May - see 20th June 2014 - scans
I have also seen a document which may relate to him, aged 16, dated 27 Oct 1859, joining the Merchant Navy and being posted aboard the "Lustre". However, I can't be sure, as no address is given. And by 1861 he was back in Lambeth, working in the bone yard. After marrying Martha at St John the Evangelist, Waterloo, he lived for a while in Clerkenwell, then they settled in Islington. Other "new" records relate to their final years. On 25 Apr 1908 Thomas was admitted to St John's Road Workhouse, then discharged to Banstead Asylum on 1 May, which explains why he died out of the area. Evidently he was ill, although no details were given, and his death was reigistered in July in the Epsom registration area. So in 1911 census Martha can be seen widowed, in St Luke's Workhouse, Shoreditch, listed again as Char but this evidently didn't bring in enough to keep her out of the Workhouse. She was buried on 28 Oct 1914 in Islington Cemetery (home address 21 Lowman Road)
interred in plot O/20026 with 13 others over a period of a month. No doubt this was one of those public plots and there is no marker.
William May Senior - Cliff's great great grandfather - see 21st June 2014 & 11th July 2016 - I think the correct marriage is 29 Jul 1811 at St Sepulcre Northampton
As you can see they were both "of this parish", so it looks like the end of the London connection (there is a birth in the area in 1791, although in 1841 census there is a "yes" against born in Surrey). As I have outlined, they spent the 20 years of their marriage working their way slowly northwards up the river bank towards Westminster Bridge and Ann died in 1831 living at Stangate Street. She was buried at St Mary's on 26 Oct, joining daughter Sarah.
[not sure why the confusion with her middle name, if they weren't sure I would have thought they'd leave it out]
Hence the 1841 census in Griffin Street, William 55 year old (give or take) waterman and daughter Mary aged 20. When he died, William was buried in Islington on 28 Apr 1844; presumably one of those burials I have mentioned at this time, where there was no longer space locally, so bodies were transferred to other areas some miles away.
William May Junior, his son, see same dates -
I mentioned that he was originally a carman then followed his father into the occupation of Thames Waterman. I have seen a document swearing him into the Worshipful Company of Paviours through the membership of his father, giving him Freedom of the City. They were a livery company responsible for the laying down and maintenance of the highways. I understand how a cabman would need to be involved if he could as it was important to travel on good surfaces. The Watermen/Lightermen equally needed good travel logistics. William Senior was a member in 1808, Junior joined in 1834. In 2016 I still had a gap in his story in 1860s & early 70s, but despite a thorough search, I still cannot track down the census returns.
As you can see from the scan of their marriage, Elizabeth was a minor, William of "full age". What it doesn't say is that she was just 19, he 48! I suspect this is why the returns are elusive; they lied about their ages, and who knows what else! He died aged 62 in Apr 1873, giving home address of 2 Wellington Road, Stockwell, buried in one of the reused plots (31/13844) at Norwood Cemetery, one of 12 burials in that plot over a period of a year
William Frank May - see 22nd June 2014 - where I told the whole story. Scans:baptism
No burial scan I am afraid, but I do know it took place on 2 Jan 1915 in Morden, Surrey, his death registered in Battersea on the last few days of December 1914.
Monday 11th March 2019
Sarah May - one of Cliff's great great-aunts - see 13th June 2014.
But first a quick summary of St Mary's Church Lambeth: the original building was pre-Norman, owned by Countess Goda, the sister of Edward the Confessor (hence Goda Street), made part of the lands of the Archbishop of Canterbury in 1197. The body of the church was rebuilt in flint and stone 1374-7, but an account in 1791 stated that only one tower remained of this. Over the centuries various changes were made and in 1972 it reached the end of life as a church and was deconsecrated. It was due to be demolished but has several famous people were buried there, including the Tradescant family, naturalists and garden experts, so the building was reinvented as a museum of garden history. Also interred there were Admiral William Bligh (famous for the Mutiny on the Bounty). Elizabeth Howard Boleyn (mother of Anne), Peter Dollond (famous optician and telescope-maker) and of course many Archbishops of Canterbury who served under many sovereigns.
I remember it as a church and my auntie was married there in Oct 1963. I have searched through the records but cannot find any family members in the burial records. This is, I understand, because there were 26,000 burials there of which 570 had memorials/stones. I have looked through these for you, and found nothing familar. But of course, something may pop up at any time with no stone etc recorded.
Returning to Sarah, she was born, christened and buried locally, at the Eastern end of Lambeth Bridge, by Lambeth Palace, and had no memorial herself
The church is bottom middle of this map (where Lambeth Bridge is now) and they lived at Bishops Walk/Stangate Street, just north of the palace (all St Thomas' Hospital these days)
I understand some of the burials were relocated when the church closed, but not that of a child from 150 years before, I would have thought.
Sarah Elizabeth May - also see 13th June 2014 - I cannot locate a baptism for her and she didn't marry. I mentioned in 2014 that she left her effects to an Alice Fanny May, who I was going to investigate. The lady I found, however, was married 25 years before, so was not May. I see now that her niece, who I have always known as Fanny, could well be the legatee; she was also employed as a servant in Islington when I lost track of her...
Sybil May - see 5th July 2016 - nothing new, except her address at death was Oakbeam Cottage, High Street, Haddenham and she left £3843.
Thomas May - see 20th June 2014 & 6th July 2016 - Cliff's great grandfather and brother of Sarah above.
Thomas Joshua May - Cliff's uncle - see 20th June 2014 & 11th July 2016 - was his grandson, born where his grandfather died, in Walworth. But he was one who was moved to Leicester for a few years, so fragmented his story.
The family was back in London in 1892, when he was 8, living in 90 Regent Street (which was renamed the next year and became Ethelred Street, as it remained until 1970s), then Goda Street, a turning off Ethelred, until he joined the Navy on 6 Sep 1907, in the Light Infantry, Chatham Division - see 2014 for his postings etc In 1920 he was back at 18 Prince's Square with his family until his marriage in 1932, when they settled in Ilford. I have had another look ar 1939 Register, and the redacted line is still hidden so am none the wiser. Fast-forwrd to his death in 1961, it appears this was in Wanstead Hospital, home address still Endsleigh Gardens, when he left £314 to Muriel. She, as I said in 2014, remained there for some years. I do now know that when she died in 1975 she was resident in Goodmayes Hospital, which was a mental health institution. She died on 25 Apr, leaving £1896.
[I think it may be closed now, services referred elsewhere and the site due for development into housing]
Sunday 10th March 2019
Phoebe Mary May - see 6th June 2014 & 4th July 2016
Phyllis G J May - see 9th June 2014 & 5th July 2016
No scan of the marriage, I am afraid, but I have had another look at 1939 Register. William is now unredacted and I can see that there is only one hidden line now in their household, the other three belong next door. I have no idea who this could be, so will have to wait a few more years... I don't know now who led me astray weith the death in 1953, as I have found a death record in Henley in Jun 1942.
Rachel Sarah May, another of Cliff's great-aunts, - see 9th June 2014 - faded out after 1871 so I had a good look for more
and managed to solve the riddle, much to my surprise. Apparently she was married aged 16 to another teen Henry Joseph Miller
and they had two children, Beatrice May Miller in 1887 and Henry (Harry) in 1889. As I cannot locate ythem in 1881 census, there may be more older children who have slipped through the net. She did confuse me by being known as Sarah and there was another Sarah married to a Henry Jasper Miller, both couples in the Lambeth area. Our Henry died there in 1929 and "Sarah" in 1930.
Rebecca Sophia May - also see 9th June 2014 -
I did know that she was widowed in 1892 but I have now seen William's burial record and it is in a familiar place; Camberwell Old Cemetery, one of those I visited in 2016, although I didn't know to look for the surname Bull. He was interred into plot 13015 on 28 Dec 1892 along with one other, then 13 more people were added over the next 12 days. As there were so many, I imagine this was one of the unmarked plots and I wouldn't haveseen anything if I had looked. By 1956 when Rebecca died, the London cemeteries were full, so she probably didn't have the option of joining him. She had anyway been living with her daughter Rebecca Emmett for some years and her death was registered in Surrey Mid-East area (Dorking), so she was no doubt buried there. 7 years later her daughter died in Walberton, Arundel, Sussex to which they had probably retired.
Rosina/Rosa Alice May was born Jun 1879 at 8 Queen Street, Walworth (nowadays King Street and Queen Street are combined and have fairly modern blocks) to William and Ellen née Hodd (Cliff's great uncle & aunt), was christened 6 Jul at St Alphege.
She appeared in 1881 census aged 1 (almost 2 really) at 7 Pontypool Place, Newington (just over a mile away) with parents & grandparents but unfortunately died in Jan 1883 aged 3½.
Ten years later Rosina Amy May was born to the same parents - see 12th June 2014 - and was christened at the same church on 6 Oct 1889:
I have a scan of her marriage
but for the rest of her story see 2014. I have more detail now about her death; she died on 27 Oct 1961 at Dulwivh Hospital aged 72, giving home address of 55 Kirkwood Road (as expected). She was cremated on 3 Nov at Honor Oak Crematorium and her ashes were scattered
William joined her 2 years later, on 29 Nov 1963, having died similarly in Dulwich Hospital on 24 Nov and cremated at Honor Oak, leaving £1025 to a Frank George Rogers.
Saturday 9th March 2019
Mary May - see 4th July 2016
She died aged 16 months and was buried in Deptford.
Mary Elizabeth May - see also 4th July 2016 - the servant who had an illegitimate baby, then married and settled in Deptford. I have seen a couple of new documents that add interesting details to her story.
She can be seen in a roster of the Workhouse in Princes Road, Lambeth, from 17th to 23rd July 1850 she (aged 29) and her son (aged 6) were residents/inmates. I don't know why they were there or if anything was done, but a few months later they were lodging with her brother William in Edward Street, by Waterloo station, a mile away to the north. The next thing we see is her marriage to Joseph Westcott:
In 1851 Joseph had been living with his widowed sister in Catherine Street, right by the Workhouse. Electoral roll records show Joseph had a shoemaking business in Deptford High Street until at least 1875. Then he continued at home in Stanley Street in 1880s. The next "new" document is her burial, on 17 Sep 1886 in Brockley Cemetery in plot H/Uncon/277/A (it seems she was never forgiven for her misdemeanour having a child out of wedlock, uncon=unconsecrated), followed in the next 2 days by 4 other unknown men. Her husband joined her 2 years later, but in a different plot.
Olive Eileen May - see 6th June 2014 & 4th July 2016 - Jack's daughter. Unfortunately no baptism has come to light. I told you she married the boy who lived opposite. In 1939 he had been living in Margate with his mother Dollie, she UDD, he "Seaman & Motor Driver". This will be why they married in Margate, his family home. His mother died there in 1981 (his father may have gone to Australia, as one with his unusual name died there in an accident in 1972). As I said in 2014, in 1956 Olive and Dave lived in Lewisham until he died on 12 Oct 1984 at 244a Baring Road, Grove Park,
leaving £14,648, presumably to Olive, who then moved to Eastbourne to look after her mother, her father having died 3 years before. Then she herself died in 1991.
Friday 8th March 2019
Julia Hetty Christina May - see 26th May 2014 & 26th June 2016 - scans:
[Lancaster Street is modern blocks now, but behind them must have been the listed buildings of Boyfield Street, still standing]
No burials I'm afraid.
Julietta Christina May was her aunt, who she was named after, to the confusion of genealogists for many years to come! See 26th May 2014 & 1st July 2016. No further details but a couple of scans:
Kenneth Leslie May - see 1st July 2016 - I have located his burial details:
and this is very informative. It seems he died in Ratcliffe Infirmary in Oxford although the family home was at Beacon View, Lewknor
There was an ancient burial ground here, called Beacon Hill, and in 1972 when the M40 motoerway was being constructed, graves were found and the area studied. Apparently the cemetery was in use in Roman times, but had been disused for centuries. There is no sign these days, and the area called Beacon Hill doesn't even appear on maps. The M40 dominates the area around and is only yards from these cottages known as Beacon View.
Leslie Frank May - also see 1st July 2016 - was his father, baptised on 28 Apr 1909 in Thame with 3 siblings:
(see Ena last Sunday, below).
2 years later, at the 1911 census, they had moved (so Google tells me) 459 feet to 64 Park Street (above right). He married in Oxfordshire but settled in London, as discussed before. After marriage they can be seen in Battersea then Southall, where they were in 1939, Leslie working as an inspector on the buses. (I had followed them in electoral roll records in Lambeth, Southwark and Lewisham, then discovered these records related to a couple with very similar names: Leslie Frank May and Dorothy May née Russell. On the marriage certificate the groom's father's name is wrong and he is a fireman).
1938 onwards - 5 Livingstone Road Southall
Son Michael had been sent out of London to live with grandmother & aunts in Oxfordshire and soon Doris and Leslie joined him and had 2 more sons. As Doris' death was registered in Oxford city itself, she may have died in hospital like her son. Leslie's was in Bullington, a part of Oxford to the east of the city.
Tuesday 5th March 2019
John May 2 - see 25th May 2014 & 20th June 2016, where I went into a lot of detail regarding his occupation on the Thames Steamers. Do take a look, it's fascinating.
There is unfortunately no scan of the marriage, but I can see details of his burial. On 16 Oct 1856 he was interred into plot F/98.6/158 at Brompton Cemetery. Over the years that followed, four further men joined him. The fact that they were all men and buried over the next 25 years suggests to me that it may have been a plot for Watermen/Steam Captains. I cannot see anything in newspapers relating to his burial, but he was the first there.
John May 3, my husband's great-grandfather, see 25th May 2014.
No scan of burial, unfortunately, and I don't know where it was
John May 4 (Jack) - see 26th May 2014 & 26th June 2016
I can't track down a burial in Eastbourne, although there must be an awful lot of them!
Joshua May - I haven't mentioned him before - was older brother of the twins, born Aug 1849 at Vauxhall Walk to Thomas & Sarah and christened on 16 Sep at St Mary's:
He can be seen aged 1 in 1851 census with parents & sibs, also uncle & family. However, he died at the end of May 1854 aged 4. I have found a burial record and at first was puzzled, wondering why he was buried across London in Hackney. Then I realised that the mid 1850s was the time when London was fast filling up with burials and several cemeteries were closed. The 1852 Burials Act allowed for transportation to places further afield, including those used by the Necropolis railway, running across from Waterloo to Brookwood Cemetery
with bodies to inter there. Now, Joshua won't have been transported by the Necropolis train, as it only started in November of that year, 5 months later. But you can see from the scan he was transported in some way (he was small after all) from home in Vauxhall and interred in the non-conformist part of the burial ground in Victoria Park, Bethnal Green, Borough of Hackney, fairly new then
If this wasn't fascinating enough, I have discovered that the cemetery was renamed Meath Gardens after it was closed 40 years later, and was situated just behind the University where my husband and I met 80 years after that! He never knew his great great-uncle was lying only yards away
Monday 4th March 2019
Harriet Charity May - see 21st May 2014 & 15th June 2016 - I have scans:
Interestingly, as you can see she was entered onto the register as Charity Harriet, and signed as such. This was a one-off though, as she was in all other documents correctly shown.
James Edward May - see 22nd May 2014 & 15th June 2016 - where I gave a detailed account up until his retirement, when I lost track of him.
Looking into the possible death record s, there is a feasible one on 23 Jun 1920 at Bolingbroke Hospital, Battersea, and I have seen the probate document, where he leaves £150 to Esther Emily May, spinster. I don't know anyone by that name but it is in the right place and she may be a cousin, niece etc I haven't yet met.
Jessie May - see 23rd May 2014 - I cannot find a baptism but have both marriage and burial, unusally for London:
St Mary's Cemetery Battersea, still there but long closed for burials. Her address was given as 3 Ceylon Street. This was quite new at that time, built in the 1860s on land adjoining St George's church in the Nine Elms part of Battersea. Now long gone, built over by the New Covent Garden Market complex.
Joan May - see 24th May 2014 & 20th June 2016 - I still think she may have been evacuated with her sister to Somerset, as the 1939 Register is definitely her sister Olive, but her possible file is still redacted. In 1960s there are electoral roll records in West Wickham, Kent for a Trevor & Joan Brooks, but I can't tell if it is them. As far as I know they are both alive, although 90 and 86 respectively.
John May 1 - see 24th May 2014 - baptism scan:
at Lambeth St Mary's
In 2014 his story faltered around the time of the 1861 census, where I thought he was working at the Hanover Arms in Peckham. Now if this was the case, he had quite a few years following this, as I suspect he made one Sarah Ivil from Hampshire pregnant in 1863 and she gave birth to a daughter Fanny, who she registered under the surname May. They did marry on 14 Sep 1867 at St Mary's Lambeth and in 1871 can be seen at 51 Marsham Street, Westminster with 8-year-old Fanny, John a "labourer in the iron trade". In 1881 they were in Islington, John an engineer, with Walter Ivil (?cousin) boarding and Fanny a resident servant in an orphanage nearby (aged 18). By 1891 they were at 57 Calverley Grove, Islington (close by) with Sarah's brother Henry and a family of boarders. As John died in 1899, in 1901 census Sarah can be seen living just around the corner with granddaughter Miriam Garrett aged 13 and lots of boarders. Yet again, by 1911 census she had moved just a short distance, living with 11-year-old grandson Stanley May, and died there in 1920 aged 81.
Sunday 3rd March 2019
Ena Constance May - see 4th June 2014 - I have a scan of her baptism now, performed with sisters Gertrude and Phyllis and brother Leslie in 1909
1939 Register shows her at 12 Kings Road, Thame with her widowed mother, sister Sybil and possible nephew Michael. Ena was transcribed as Eva, listed as "saleslady wools & childrens wear". 2 years later she married Eric Pearce but he died 2 years after that, hence no children. She only followed him 50 years later, in 1993, aged 85, when she was living at 8 Old Mill Close, Haddenham, Aylesbury
Ethel Grace May, my husband's grandmother, was covered in detail on 17th & 20th May 2014 & 21st Nov 2015. The only new record I have found was admission to Harper Street School from Lollard Street School on 2 Sep 1907. This was odd because it was over the border in Southwark. I can't be certain it was her as, although the date of birth was 18 Oct, it was a year out, although her father was given as John, and Lollard Street School would have been the correct infants' school. As it was, she only attended for 6 months before being removed, so maybe they found a place somewhere nearer to home. The address given on this record was 6 Ayliffe Street, which was in Newington. So if this was correct, they moved back into Kennington in time for the 1911 census. John had died in 1905, so this may explain the temporary chaos. I can bring you a scan of her baptism:
when she was christened at St Mary the Less church, Princes Street
with two younger sisters. I have no scan of the marriage, as these only go up to 1932, the year before!
Ethel Louise May - see 30th May 2014 & 14th June 2016 - scan of her marriage:
I see now that in 1939 she was housekeeper to Michael Thompson, student of Aeronautical Engineering, whose parents no doubt paid her wages (he was 23 at the time). When she died, she was in Honey Lane Hospital, Waltham Abbey
This was originally an isolation hospital for smallpox and the like, in the days of this photo (taken when it was brand new in 1907). But by 1952 it had become a general hospital, and she died here on 19 May 1978, leaving £9397.
Florence Maud May - see 14th June 2016 - emigrated to Australia, married there and I lost track of her.
Gertrude Olive May - see also 14th June 2016 - see Ena above for baptism
I have sorted out hr confusing marriages by finding the one to Carl Starup in the name of Bonnet, so it was evidently a second marriage. I don't know why she was also registered under her maiden-name, maybe it was an error. Anyway, on 31 Aug 1929 in Flaunden Herts she married Leslie Percival Bonnet:
I know these are only banns (called in both Herts and Oxfordshire) but I am informed that she definitely married him. Oddly, it looks as though they divorced, although this was very rare and I cannot find a record. They both remarried in 1943, Gertrude to Carl Starup as I said, and Leslie to Joan Villette Hutt from Royston, Herts, "an artist who made cinema slides". Both Joan and Leslie died in Wales in 1985, another genealogist tells me Gertrude died in Copenhagen, but has no idea where Carl came form or went to.
Friday 1st March 2019
Before I continue, I would like to share the good news with you. Findmypast have given notice that they will soon start work on the 1921 census. This is the first in years and may well be the last, as the records of the census taken in 1931 were damaged in WW2. It will be released in Jan 2022, which is less than 3 years away now!
Edward May - see 15th May 2014 - this was left very vague when studied previously, so I was pleased to see Ancestry had come up with some suggestions to help. However, they have only succeeded in confusing the issue further, I am afraid. Various records with various middle names, some married, some not, have blurred the issue until I no longer know who he is. I lean towards the death in 1896 in Battersea but cannot find him in 1891 to corroborate this. I did find a birth registration in Apr 1850 in Chelsea, but no baptism, but of course this wasn't mandatory.
Eiley Mary Muncey May (always sounds to me like "Eeny Meeny Miney Mo"!) - see 30th May 2014 (out of sequence) & 8th June 2016, where I explained why she was born in Scotland, raised in Oxfordshire and ended up in Essex. Nothing has changed since, even the redacted file, possibly servant/nurse in 1939, but I have seen her probate document, giving exact date of death as 20 Dec 1969 aged 90. She died at 31 Theydon Park Road, Theydon Bois, Essex, leaving £1884.
[this house has obviously had a significant extension since then. Photo dates from 2008, which is as far back as I can go on Google Streetview]
Ellen Louisa May - see 16th May 2014 & 8th June 2016. Scans:
And I now have a lot more details regarding her death & burial. When she died in Dec 1968 she was interred into plot C/Con/202 in Brockley Cemetery, joining her husband George, who had died in Sep 1951, and his parents George & Amelia, who had died in 1936 & 1918 respectively. In that plot too were earlier occupants; families named Matthews and Banks (I don't know who these people were, but probably not related to me and my Matthews families).
Emma May - see 16th May 2014 & 13th June 2016. All details were there; Ancestry has just given me some hints, but they were all wrong, so I shall just bring you a marriage scan:
I had thought I found a baptism but although parents were John & Mary Ann in Chelsea, baptised at the same time were siblings John born 1842 and Rebecca born 1847 and father John was a bootcloser, not a waterman, so I have thrown them out. Unfortunately, she did not survive until 1939 Register.
Tuesday 26th February 2019
Before I start on the Mays, I must reassure you that it does not contain one ineffectual prime minister!
Alice May - see 9th May 2014 & 6th June 2016 - scans:
The only other new things since last time is that son Jackie has been unredacted from the 1939 Register, and I now know the address in Edmonton where Alice lived when she died; 6 Cuckoo Hall Lane
Alice Sarah May - see 10th May 2014 & 6th June 2016 - scans:
Amy Constance Elizabeth May - also see 10th May 2014 & 6th June 2016
with several siblings, but unfortunately no marriage and/or burial scans.
Beatrice May May - see 12th May 2014 & 6th June 2016
I have found her baptism, on Findmypast as Ancestry doesn't have it:
at All Saints, Leicester
(the font dates from 13th Century so will have been the one used)
Oh, by the way, I found out that her son-in-law "Lefty" was Albert Francis Trull Junior from Massachusetts.
Charles May - see 30th May 2014 & 7th Jun 2016. This account is very detailed and I have no updates, so I suggest you use the tabs above a look there.
His son Charles William May - see 4th Jun 2014. I still haven't tracked him down in 1901 but I did find his death in 1959 in Calgary, Canada and burial in Burnsland Cemetery.
Monday 25th February 2019
Marian Parker - see 29th Apr 2016 - born in 1888 to George William senior & Elizabeth (see yesterday). Scans:
I have discovered a lot about her husband, so will tackle him now. Herbert William Hill was born in London on 17 Nov 1882 and was baptised on 18 Feb 1883 at St Luke's, West Kilburn:
Incidentally, his father had the wonderful name of Joseph Remington Hill and was born in Great Dalby, Leics, which as you know if you are a regular here, is where my maternal grandmother's ancestors originate. Small world! On 26 Aug 1910 Herbert attested to the 19th City of London Regiment, Territorial Force, stating he was a driver, lived at 11 Argyle Street and was 27 years old. He gave his father as Next of Kin,address 78 Highgate Hill, Holloway. He had a medical and was passed fit for service. He served "at home" for the next 5 years (i.e. UK) so in 1911 census can be seen working in a hotel in Argyle Street as a porter. On 7 Aug 1912 in Edmonton he married Marian and had 2 sons before he was sent to France to fight with the Expeditionary Force in 1915. He came home for 5 months, then was sent off again 6 Feb 1916, when he was transferred from 1st to the 3rd battalion. On 15 Sep 1916 he was declared missing and was found to be a Prisoner Of War! On 9 Dec 1916 he was returned to UK in an Exchange of Prisoners programme, but was no longer fit for service. He was issued a £15 "bounty" and discharged, having served 6½ years and earned the 1914-15 Star medal. His health was evidently compromised but I don't know any details. Just that he died in 1924 aged 41 in Edmonton.
Mary Ann Parker - see 5th May 2014 - I have scans:
(aged 8 with her sister Amelia)
(witnesses her sister Eliza & husband Charles). I also know now that she was buried on 17 Apr 1938 at Waltham Forest Cemetery, presumably because Joseph had been 3 years before (although I cannot find a record)
William Henry Parker - see 6th May 2014 & 1st May 2016 - I searched again for them in 1939 Register, to no avail, so all I can offer are two scans:
and similarly no firm burial records.
William James Parker - see 6th May 2014 - I cannot find anything after 1861 census, so do believe he died aged 22 in 1870, unfortunately.
Sunday 24th February 2019
Emma Amelia Parker - see 1st May 2014 & 26th Apr 2016 - unfortunately I can't find a baptism or burial but have a scan of her marriage:
It is rather faint, but you may be able to make out that this was one of those where the father's name was wrong. It says "Albert Parker deceased". I think this is a classic misunderstanding on the part of the registrar; because her father Charles had died 4 years before, she was probably given away by her older brother Albert (eldest, Charles was in the Royal Navy and no doubt away) and the registrar got the wrong end of the stick!
George William Parker senior (great great-uncle) - see 1st May 2014 & 29th Apr 2016 - where I told their dramatic story. I now have scans:
(the curate seems to have been confused over the name of his father James!)
but no further details, apart from a rather scary picture of the only known surviving doll made by Elizabeth's father Anthony in 1850 and a photo of Ely Place, off Harman Street, where smallpox raged
James Parker junior my great great grandfather - see 2nd May 2014 & 29th Apr 2016 - when I managed to straighten him and his wife out. All I can show you is the banns, but it does say the marriage took place on 1 Jan 1837:
His father James Parker senior, my 3xgreat grandfather is still very messy, as I have 3 possibilities for baptism and different sets of parents, giving several dates of birth in 1782 & 1793. I believe the latter, as I have seen the 1851 census record of 34 Sudeley Street, Islington, showing him aged 58, a Master Jeweller (I wish I could tell my Dad), with wife Harriot and apprentice Stephen Hoole. He died the following year and was buried on 9 Sep 1852 at St Mary's, Islington. I have sought 1841 census and found dozens to fit Harriot but with no James. Equally, there are several deaths but the only one in Islington is before the marriage date, so is no good.
There were also two John Henry Parkers, one the son of James & Ann and one of George & Elizabeth.
John Henry Parker 1 - see 5th May 2014 - was the eldest son of James Junior & Ann, who died aged 19
Unfortunately I can't find a burial.
John Henry Parker 2 - see 29th Apr 2016, ostensibly born 1896 to George W & Elizabeth above, but I have now found a baptism that throws the cat among the pigeons: 1894 St Luke's, Islington
making him 18 months older than he thought... they said he was 5 in Apr 1901, when he was really 7, when you would have thought it would mean a lot. However, ths was the period they lived in the very unhealthy area. They were very lucky to survive; only brother William died in infancy and one out of five was quite normal. There is a marriage to an Edith Phyllis Hooper in her home town of Upper Sapey nr Worcester and a 1939 Register to go with it, at a cottage called The Oaks, The Common, Upper Sapey, John and his son William farm labourers, Edith UDD and two closed files. Other trees have children on them; apart from William born 1920, Mavis in 1924, Henry in 1927 and Geoffrey 1930. There are also deaths in the correct area; in 1958 for Edith and 1973 for John.
Saturday 23rd February 2019
As described in previous years, there were three generations of Charles James Robert Parkers.
CJR Parker 1 - see 24th Apr 2014 & 26th Apr 2016 - b 1852 - this is especially interesting with the detail of Gilpin Grove I mentioned yesterday.
I now believe the correct marriage to be in 1883 to Mary Ann Canfield in Aston, Herts, not far from here, as it has the correct father's name. Aston and Edmonton are only 22 miles apart, but from my perspective in opposite directions (in fact to get from one to the other, you have to pass right by my house!). Nevertheless, for some region they settled in Edmonton and the rest of the dynasty followed.
CJR Parker 2 was his son - see 25th Apr both 2014 & 2016 - b 1884.
He was brought up in Edmonton, then in the Royal Navy. I can't find a scan of his marriage in 1922 to Minnie Speller, unfortunately, nor details of burial.
CJR Parker 3 - also see 25th Apr both 2014 & 2016 - b 1924. Nothing new here, I'm afraid. Lots of questions remain unanswered, for example why he died in Milton Keynes and what happened to his wife Patricia. Of course she may be still alive aged 92. No scans either, as this was all too recent. I can see them in electoral roll records, living at 1 Junction Road, Edmonton 1949-60 at least.
Edith Parker - see 26th Apr both 2014 & 2016 - daughter of CJR 2 above
but nothing new.
Eliza Ann Parker, great great-aunt, see 26th Apr 2014 - she was the elder sister who married Charles Prangnell senior (see Amelia yesterday). I have scans:
She was buried on 19 Jan 1926 in Islington Cemetery, in plot Z/16914 with 27 others, interred over a 5 week period to 27 Mar 1926. As a widow she may not have been able to afford a proper burial plot and just had a public one. At least the dates and names were recorded.
My great grandmother Emily Ann Parker was covered in detail on 28th Apr 2014 & 24th Feb 2016, the latter showing her in Woolwich with daughter Alice Pilott & family, described as "Invalid OAP". She died 3 months later, on 3 Jan 1940 and was buried in plot N/1444 of Plumstead Cemetery
In 16 and 27 years, John and Alice joined her in the grave.
Friday 22nd February 2019
Today would have been my father's 97th birthday. Happy Birthday in Heaven, Dad. So it's appropriate to stay on his tree for just a little longer. Following the pattern of previous years, I shall study his paternal grandmother Emily's branch, the Parkers.
Albert Edward Parker was born in 1887 to Emily's brother Charles and his wife Mary Ann, and can be seen with them aged 4 in 1891 census at 5 Leicester Terrace, Lawrence Road, Edmonton, the family having recently moved there from Holborn. In 1901 there were more children in the house, so they had moved round to 6 Gilpin Grove and Albert was working as an Errand Boy. On Christmas Eve 1905 at St James church, Upper Edmonton he married Jane Elizabeth Howard and they moved into 44 Gilpin Grove.
The Bell at Edmonton was famously a place mentioned in the John Gilpin story, so several features in this area are named after him. As you can see, Albert was at that time working as a warehouseman. They had a son Henry here in 1907 then moved to Deptford, where they had daughter Dorothy in 1910. They can be seen the following year in the census at 338 Evelyn Street, Deptford with 2 young children and Albert's brother William aged 15. This area is now modern blocks, so I can't bring you a photo. As there was significant bomb damage here in WW2 I suspect all was lost. The census records show the reason for moving south of the River; Albert had joined the Metropolitan Police. The police station was a short walk behind the house, in Amersham Vale, and has now been converted into a museum/gallery
so no doubt Albert would recognise his workplace should he return today. I'm not sure how long he worked there, as by 1921 they had moved back to Edmonton. Daughter Rose was born there then, and by 1939 Register they seem well established. They were living in Fore Street, near their home of 1901, and working as pillars of the community. Albert was listed as Town Hall Keeper (it makes sense, a lot of police officers move onto caretaker roles). Jane is described as "cleaning staff supervisor", so I suspect it was the Town Hall she cleaned. The Town Hall in Edmonton was in Fore Street, built in 1884, extended in 1903 and demolished 1989
There was also a closed file, probably Dorothy as I cannot find her elsewhere, and Rose, listed as "unfit for work". She married in 1948 but cannot have been very unfit as she lasted until 2003. Henry was married and living in Southgate, not far away. Examining the editorial roll records, I can see Albert had been at the same address since at least 1925, maybe before 1921 but I have no baptism for Rose to confirm. He died in Edmonton on 1 Nov 1955 aged 68.
Amelia Jane Parker - see 24th Apr 2014 & 25th Apr 2016. She was Emily's youngest sister but please see previous tabs for the convoluted story. I can now bring you scans though:
Not burial I am afraid, for Amelia or Charles.
Tuesday 19th February 2019
I spent the whole of today checking the burials at West Norwood Cemetery against all of my trees and have now completed them. I have nothing new to bring you, so will move on again on Friday to the next of the Maintenance Checks.
Monday 18th February 2019
Henry Edward Matthews died in infancy, born in the October quarter of 1899 to Robert Edward and Florence Beatrice, he was buried a year later on 19 Nov in plot 7E17 of Bath Abbey Cemetery. 5 unknown people were also in that plot, Henry being the third, over a 45-year period (of a variety of ages).
Iris Caroline Keen née Matthews died on 16 Jul 2005 in Bath and was buried on 4 Oct in Haycombe Cemetery:
in plot 21A336. Her husband Maurice was still alive (and in the Bath area) in 2010, although he was then 88.
Jane Tucker née Matthews may have been buried in 1865 in Lyn & Wid cemetery, as her husband Thomas was there 40 years later. However I cannot be sure of this as there is no date of birth on her plot.
I dealt with Louisa Burgess née Matthews under Alice Kate last Monday - see below - who died aged 81 and was buried on 22 May at Locksbrook St Saviour's, joining her husband and daughter.
Mary Ann Hill née Matthews died aged 48 and was buried 8 Jan 1886 at Locksbrook St Swithin. Her husband had been buried there early the previous year (not in the same grave, but without plot numbers...
When I updated Nellie Doris Iris Witts née Matthews on 29th Jan below, I had little information on the end of her (and Ivor's) life. So it was a nice surprise to find her on this list with lots of added detail. When Ivor died in 1980 he was buried in plot 30J400 in Haycombe cemetery
and Nellie joined him on 20 Jul 2004 aged 82. Their only son (the other three were girls) Michael died aged 13 months in 1951 and was commemmorated on a little stone here.
Rosina Kathleen May née Matthews, daughter of Robert & Henrietta, is also buried at Haycombe, plot 30A380. Wat seems odd here is that she was buried with the brother of her first husband John Vallance, who had been interred into the plot in 1966. Harold had gone to Lyn & Wid cemetery when he died in 1941 with a bunch of others. That cemetery had closed in 1937 when Haycombe opened, but I had thought spouses could us existing plots. Not a lot shows nowadays, and there isn't an inscription to help
Her second husband lived until 2005 and was buried in Haycombe plot 21A427 on his own.
Sarah Elizabeth Matthews, daughter of Silas & Sarah née Coombs, died aged 4 and was buried at Locksbrook St Swithin on 27 Nov 1884.
Edith May Matthews née Gifford was buried on 24 Nov 1960 plot 43H424 Haycombe Cemetery aged 61 and was joined there by her husband (Silas) William James on 8 Sep the following year aged 66.
Violet May Matthews married Sidney James Miller in 1936, they had 5 children then he died 2 May 1968 aged 55. He was buried in plot 42R388 at Haycombe and she joined him on 6 Aug 1990, aged 73
William Jonathan Matthews was born in 1863 to Jonathan & Mary Ann. He died aged almost 13 and was buried on 16 Mar 1876 in Locksbrook St Swithin
Sunday 17th February 2019
On to burials of the Silases, all three in Locksbrook St Swithin's.
Silas Matthews 2 born in 1822, died on 17 Feb 1875 aged 52, registered by his second wife Sarah (who isn't buried here as she had remarried and moved away).
His son Silas Matthews 3, born 1856, died 1923 aged 67
His son Silas James Matthews born 1877 died 27 Oct 1943 aged 66
The next burial, Violet Matthews, was very interesting. I have told the story before (see 10th Apr 2014, 13th Apr 2016 & 5th Feb 2019) of the air-raid in 1942. Violet was the one who went home after visiting the cinema and her body was found by her brother Leonard. She was evidently buried in plot 38Q221 at Haycombe cemetery along with Lilian Chapman and Gilbert Robbins, killed the same day (but unknown to me), on 1 May 1942.
Haycombe cemetery in Whiteway Road opened in Jul 1937 and all of the other local cemeteries were closed. It originally occupied 30 acres, containing over 23,000 plots, including an area set aside for military graves
There was a mass burial on 1 May 1942, as the Bath Chronicle reported “Simple coffins, they were; plainly constructed with, in most cases just a name - occasionally several names- and a number, painted in black paint. Some bore only a number, others just one-word explanation, “Unidentified.” There were further mass burials during that week." Violet's case was evidently more informed, as Leonard found her.
The Crematorium was built at the western end of the site in 1961 and there have been over 110,000 cremations to date. There is a memorial wall surrounding the courtyard for cremation memories. In 2012 a further piece of ground was opened and extended the area.
William Matthews 1 born 1882 to Silas 3 & Sarah Coombes, died aged 60 later in 1942 and was buried on 29 Nov in plot 41S317, occupied the previous year by a Thomas Griffiths (who I don't know). This is evidently not a related death, as sections 38 & 41 are not together:
William Matthews 2 born 1868 to Silas 2 & Sarah Williams died aged 46 was buried 30 Apr 1915 in Locksbrook St Swithin's. His wife Nellie went on to remarry but both she and her second husband Henry Dunford died in 1938 and were buried in the same cemetery (separate plots).
William Walter Matthews died aged 22 months and was buried in St Swithin's. It isn't clear whereabouts and maybe a little clarification is in order
St Swithin's Church originally dates from 10th Century (parts of the crypt are original) with 33,168 burials from 1711. The church was pulled down in 1777 an the current much larger building constructed.
Much of the cemetery shown here has gone and the chapel is now a gallery (Walcot Gate), but there are still gravestones around it.
Lansdown cemetery took most of the Walcot burials after 1848 then Locksbrook from 1864.
So, William Walter is probably in the graveyard above at Walcot Gate.
Charles Reginald Matthews was an odd record. He was said to have died aged 40 but his birth and death dates were 50 years apart, so I put him to one side to look at later. If I ignore the obviously wrong date of birth, he could well be my Charles Reginald, who died 15 Dec 1963 aged 41, his birth being in Oct 1922. He was last seen in 1939 Register at 22 Otago Terrace with his mother, grandmother and brothers, and this was still his home when he died, although this took place at St Martin's Hospital, and he was buried at Locksbrook St Swithin's.
I found two Edwin Barnard Matthews, Senior born 1826, died aged 81 on 4 Apr 1908 at 8a Westgate Street, buried on 10 Apr in plot 7.24 in Bath Abbey Cemetery.His son EBM Junior died only two years later, but in the Royal United Hospital, Walcot, which may be why he was interred in Locksbrook Cemetery St Swithin's - see Monday - in what was called a "family plot" but no records show any other burials. Son Albert followed in 1917 and Emma's remains were moved to join them (she having died in 1916)
Florence Mary Matthews was a baby who died in infancy and was buried on 21 Dec 1912 in plot PL67 in the St Saviours section of Locksbrook Cemetery. Her parents had only just got married at this time, and didn't die themselves for many years. I can't track down her father, as he died in 1930 and doesn't appear on this list. Her mother Henrietta née Jones died aged 96 in 1980 and I have found her here, buried in the St Swithin's section.
Another buried in Locksbrook St Swithin's was Florence Valentine Tucker née Matthews, iterred in 1945 after dying aged 53.
Yet another was George Henry Matthews, born 26 Sep 1919 to Silas James & Lily. He died aged 16 months and was buried in Feb 1921.
Saturday 16th February 2019
The next burial plot was a revelation. I found plot no. PB22 of Lyncombe & Widcombe cemetery because it was used to hold Herbert George William Matthews in 1937, after his death aged 39 on 12 July that year. His address was given as Westfield House, Bloomfield Road, which you may remember was the Bath address of Herbert William, the famous architect, who was his father
He (HGW) was buried on 15 Jul 1937, and I see now that the same plot was used for his parents. Unfortunately, as with a lot of these photos, the plot has been neglected in recent years, and now looks like this:
There was apparently an inscription but I don't know what it said. His mother Minnie Agnes née Candy was next in the plot, buried on 9 Jul 1945 after dying on 6 Jul aged 69. I got a surprise when I looked at her husband's record though, as it seems he remarried almost immediately. I see that in the October quarter of that year in Marylebone he married Constance Arline (I am not sure if this was her maiden name or she was married before but I know her date of birth was 12 Jan 1886, so she was 10 years younger than her husband). I cannot find her 1939 Register entry but she was living in Chelsea through the 30s under this name. They were only together for 9 years, though, as Herbert died on 4 Mar 1954 and was buried in the plot on 8 Mar. Constance continued to live in London, and died there on 15 Aug 1970 aged 84, buried with the others here in Bath on 26 Aug and leaving £42,583 (although I don't know whether to Margaret & John, Herbert's remaining children, or not). I can see from his death record that Herbert did have two addresses; 3 Dunraven Street, Park Lane, London W1, where he died, and Westfield House, Bath.
John Matthews was buried in Locksbrook cemetery, St Swithin's part, on 27 Mar 1901, having died 2 days before at Morford Street, Bath. He was the one who married twice, lastly to Hannah who had a criminal record but went on to become a nurse. He was 74 at his death, but I cannot find Hannah in 1901 census and he had described himself in 1891 census as "widowed", so all is confusing. There is no sign of Hannah in this burial plot and there is a note "second interment", suggesting his remains were moved, but from where? I think that Hannah was buried in this cemetery too, 6 years later, but with no plot numbers I am none the wiser.
Jonathan Matthews was also buried in that cemetery, on 7 Jul 1893, having died aged 66 two days before, of apoplexy at 2 Turners Buildings. His wife Mary Ann was informant, present at the death, but she was evidently unwell herself, as she died 3 months later. She was buried in a different plot, but as neither had numbers, I cannot tell if they were buried near each other, again.
Robert Matthews was buried in the same cemetery on 11 Jul 1892, having died aged 37. As his wife remarried, she was buried under her new name of Walker, and I haven't looked her up.
There are two Roberts who died as children: one Robert Matthews on 18 Jun 1852 aged 3 at the Union burial ground at the Workhouse. This was in Midford Road, and at that time was new, having only been built in 1846
(an article in the Bath Chronicle in 1847 said: “the Bishop proceeded to the Union Workhouse and consecrated a piece of ground for the interment of such poor persons as may die within the house. Thus the inconvenience of removing the bodies to different parishes will in future be obviated.”) The original graveyard was an area of ground to the southeast of the chapel and held 1111 burials, with two memorials, including one to Eddie Cochran, who was killed here on the way home and is buried in California. In Apr 1858 a second ground was consecrated by the Radstock Road, took 3191 burials and was closed in 1899. Thereafter those who died in the workhouse were buried at home in their individual wards. I did mention this place on 8th February - see below - in its latter years as an independent institution. Robert's mother Emily Matthews née Matravers was also in the workhouse with him at the time and she died the following year, aged 28, and was buried here too (but not in the same plot).
The other Robert Matthews (my 3xgreat uncle) was buried on 7 Apr 1815 aged 5 in the Independent Burial Ground attached to the Argyle Chapel, Snow Hill. This area has been redeveloped and the burials can no longer be seen. Apparently the land was in a bad state in the 1950s and the council tried to tidy it up. Many of the records were also lost, so all that is known is there were over 1100 burials and 66 vaults, dating from 1790.
Oh, in plot number G10 with Uncle Robert there were also another 6 burials dating from 1805-1815, but none was related.
Friday 15th February 2019
This seems to be a week for release of cemetery lists. As you are aware, I am currently going through Bath Burial List for Matthews ancestors buried in that city. Today Deceased Online have announced thousands of burials in West Norwood Cemetery, Borough of Lambeth, London. As I have several major branches in that area I have been looking them over and will bring news at a later date. This means I haven't done anything in Bath today, so will have to continue that tomorrow.
Tuesday 12th February 2019
Continuing with the theme of yesterday, the burials in Bath, the next one is in the cemetery called
Bath Abbey Cemetery
Now, this did initially confuse me, as Bath Abbey is in the centre of the city and has no grounds around it for burial. The cemetery is a mile away to the south-east, on a triangle of land purchased in 1844, by the rector of the abbey from the catholic bishop, next to the catholic burial ground. You can see the Abbey from there:
It covers 5 acres and contains 6439 burials and 2036 memorials.
The plot I am most interested in here is 4C29, where Doris Laura Matthews and her parents (Richard) Edward and Florence Beatrice née Byfield are.
Florence died on 13 Feb 1955 (i.e. 64 years ago tomorrow) aged 75 and was interred into this plot on 17th, then her husband joined her on 2 Jul 1963 aged 89. Their daughter Doris died 19 Mar 1977 aged 73 and joined them in the grave, although she was not added to the inscription. The flower vase stone may be hers, I can't tell from the photo.
The next burial of interest is that of Eliza Margaret Matthews née Robins, who I dealt with last Friday. As I said then, William died in 1919 and Eliza lived in London, until she died in 1941. What I didn't say last week was that they were both buried in Twerton. I now see that they joined Eliza's sister Maria in her plot.
Twerton Cemetery is another piece of land to the south of Bath given over to local burial. In 1881, the Twerton Burial Board considered a plot of land on the Wells Road as a possible cemetery but this was too close to houses to comply with the regulations on burials. Instead a 2½ acre plot was bought from the Trustees of Bellott’s Hospital later that year. There were 8438 burials and 814 memorials and it too closed in 1937 when Haycombe opened
Maria Mulhall née Robins was buried in plot CMM16 on 7 Jun 1917 having died aged 77, then William joined her 2 years later, followed on 7 Apr 1941 by Eliza. The plot is rather neglected nowadays, unfortunately:
(there is apparently an inscription but not visible here)
I dealt with George James Matthews on 10th Feb 2014, outlining how he lived with his parents all his life until they died, then he died a few years later. I can see now that his mother Jane née Rackett died aged 71 and was buried in Locksbrook St Saviour's (see yesterday) plot BG150 on 26 Mar 1884. James followed her on 7 Jul 1889 aged 75 and then George joined them on 24 Jun 1894 aged 47.
Gordon Samuel Ronald Matthews was brother of the twins Doris & Iris that I mentioned yesterday. He was stillborn or died in early infancy, and I cannot locate a baptism (although his birth was registered in Walcot in Apr 1930. He has an entry in the burial register of Locksbrook in the St Swithon's section, but no plot number or inscription.
The next burial is that of Harry Charles Matthews, painter & decorator, who died aged 75, living at Avalon, Midford Road, South Stoke, Bath. This is very much the southern outskirts of Bath, Midford Road runs south-east to Midford, and the village of South Stoke is just off it. St James church is surrounded by graves and some are very old. Records date from 1800 and there are 1008 to date, with 189 memorials. Apparently it is still open, but only to those living locally
Although his wife Elizabeth died the following year there does not appear to be a record of her joining him. Many of the gravestones here have been photographed but many have no inscription that can be identified, including this record.
The next burial on the list is that of Henry Matthews and two Sarahs. This is plot 3E23 in Lansdown Cemetery, a logical step as Ballance Street is just off Lansdown Road, which leads north out of Bath and the cemetery is 1½ miles up Lansdown Road. Photos I took when my mother and I visited in 2009:
Lansdown Cemetery opened in 1848 and holds 5785 burials. The council mows it in November, so in June when we visited ot was rather overgrown with grass etc and we didn't manage to identify much. Beckford Tower adorns the site, erected by the daughter of William Beckford, the owner of the site, and one of the first "residents".
Plot 3E23 was originally occupied by Henry's mother known as Sarah, although a note on the record says "forename Mary in burial register" and I know her as Mary née Gilbert. She died 16 Jun 1871 of "senile decay" aged 72 at 31 Ballance Street and was buried on 21 Jun. Although I am told her husband Robert died the following year he isn't mentioned here and to be honest I can't find a death record. The next to be buried in the plot was Henry himself, who died at Gloucester Terrace aged only 46 and was buried with his mother on 21 Jan 1877. He was followed 11 years later by his wife Sarah Ann née Alexander, who joined him 6 Nov 1888 aged 56, by which time she was living in Wells Road, south of the river, but still joined her family in Lansdown.
Monday 11th February 2019
I have found in the Bath burial list no fewer than 28 of my Matthewses, so will examine each in detail.
Albert Edwin Matthews was previously quite unsatisfactory, so it is good to find more on him. He was born in 1872 and in looking for him today I have found a baptism previously elusive:
I think I have tracked Mary Ann down too, in 1939 Register, living in Holwell Cottages, Frome. Both her death and Albert's were registered in Wells, Somerset registration area, so they may have lived at that address for some years. Mary Ann died not long after the Register was taken, and I can't see her burial on this list, so she presumably didn't join him. His interment was in Locksbrook Cemetery and it's worth spending some time on it here.
This cemetery sits to the west of Bath, on Upper Bristol Road. It opened in 1864 with separate areas for the parishioners of St Swithin's in Walcot and St Saviour's. A further section for Weston opened in 1877. There were 29,591 burials for Walcot, with the first burial on 17 Jan 1864, the area covering 12 acres, laid out by Edward Milner, the landscape gardener to the Crystal Palace project, who no doubt inspired Herbert in his designs for the Exhibition many years later. Map of the cemetery:
While on the subject, the St Saviours section was open 1864-1998 and took 4550 burials in this time. The area slopes down rather to the river
The Weston section also opened in 1877 and has 5322 plots. It too slopes down rather at the edges
All are now closed, as Haycombe is now the only cemetery open for new interments, and it has the crematorium.
Moving on, Alice Kate Matthews (aka Kate) was the sister who stayed on at Holly Mount, Belgrave Road to help take care of the 11 children of Louisa and George Burgess, when the rest of her family moved away. It isn't a surprise then that at her death she was buried in the Burgess plot in Locksbrook. They evidently attended St Saviour's as this was in that section of the cemetery.The plot concerned held Kate's nephew baby Victor Thomas, who died in infancy in 1879 and niece Bessie Kate who died unmarried in 1910, aged 33 (possibly named after our Kate). When Kate died aged 71 on 30 Apr 1923 she joined them, interred on 3 May, and 19 years later was joined in 1944 by 75-year-old Edith Ann, another niece who lived by then in Weston-super-mare but died in St Martin's Hospital, Bath. Kate's sister Louisa was buried in a separate plot with husband George and another of the children Nellie. George had died in 1904, Nellie in 1906 and Louisa joined them in 1931.
You may remember that Silas William James Matthews married Edith May Gifford in late 1920 and had twins Doris & Iris a few weeks later, and they died at or shortly after birth. They were buried on 16 Mar 1921 at Lyncombe & Widcombe/St James cemetery, which opened in 1861 and interred 24,724 before closing. It sits on the Lower Bristol Road just southeast of Locksbrook, between that and Bath city
As you can see, it has a large part dedicated to Nonconformists and there are large parts unconsecrated too. There was much bomb-damage in WW2 and not all of the cemetery has been mapped and identified. There were many memorials which have not been discovered since.
The baby twins were placed in a plot already holding a baby Kate Wiltshire, a 23-year-old Jane Newton and 79-year-old William Walker, at he same time as a Mark Payton was interred. I don't know if this was significant, as I haven't identified a link. In 1942 a 67-year-old Queenie Trapps joined them.
Sunday 10th February 2019
William Matthews 4 my 5xgreat grandfather - see 18th Apr 2016 - I have a scan of his baptism in 1719
(smudgy date at the end says "Nov 13"). Otherwise nothing new.
William Ewart Matthews - see 17th Apr 2014 & 18th Apr 2016. One thing I do like about Ancestry purchasing the 1939 Register is that records attached to our Ancestry trees are always updated. Thus Bernard's closed file that I mentioned has now been opened and all 6 family members are there. Otherwise nothing new, though, as Worcester is not well covered for baptisms.
William Francis Matthews, his father - see 17th Apr 2014 & 20th Apr 2016 - he appears not to have been baptised, so I cannot confirm (or otherwise) his father being called "William" on his marriage:
As far as I know, he was always called "Edwin Barnard" - maybe this was one of those cased of mis-hearing or misunderstanding. He died aged 45 in Jan 1912 in Worcester, so no further info.
My grandfather William George Matthews - also see 17th Apr 2014 & 20th Apr 2016 - nothing new apart rom scans:
The other William George Matthews - see 20th Apr 2016 - nothing (there was a record showing he was killed in WW1 in France/Flanders but I don't think it was him).
William Horace Matthews - see 20th April 2014 & same 2016, my Uncle Will. As I said in 2016, the 1939 Register was dealt with on 24th Feb, where I showed them in Beckenham, living over the shop. I had a message from the shop in recent years to confirm Bernard now ran the shop/owns the business.
William Jonathan Matthews died aged 13 and was buried in the part of the Locksbrook Cemetery for parishioners from Walcot St Swithin's. I shall return to this later or tomorrow.
William Walter Matthews died aged 18 months and was buried at St Swithin's itself. Also see later.
Winifred Jessamine Matthews - see 18th Apr 2014 & 20th Apr 2016 - I have a scan of her baptism:
but not marriage, as this was too recent. 1939 Register was dealt with in 2016 but I can now add a couple of details. The closed record appares to be a J Drummond, so could be a child but I cannot locate a birth to go with it (it is still closed, but the name is poking out of the redaction due to a correction on the original). Also, both she and John volunteered for service in wartime; he as an ARP warden for his company, she a volunteer at the police canteen. When Winifred died on 21 Jan 1994 she was living at 2 St Marys Close, Timsbury (and had been there 2 years prior to this, when John died). She was cremated at Haycombe Crematorium on 28 Jan, leaving £125,000.
I was delighted to find, on searching for these, that the local archive in Bath have transcribed the thousands of records of burials in Bath cemeteries and churchyards. The listings are vast, so I shall study them and get back to you tomorrow.
Friday 8th February 2019
William Matthews 1 - see 14th Apr 2014 & 18th Apr 2016, when I couldn't find him in 1939 Register. I have now done so, as expected in an institution. This was called at the time the Public Assistance Institution, Frome Road House, at Odd Down
He was one of hundreds of inmates and patients there, and I assume the death record in Oct 1942 was his; residents were buried in one of two cemeteries nearby:
The workhouse was built in 1836, when the Poor Law Union was set up, and in WW2 contained a EMS unit (Emergency Medical Service), then in 1948 was incorporated into the NHS as St Martin's Hospital. It closed in 2010 and has now been converted into apartments.
William Matthews 2 - also see 14th Apr 2014 - had an interesting story, as he was the one who was at the Industrial School, then spent 7 years in Canada, returning to marry and produce one son. I can now add one more snippet, as his son Silas in his WW1 documentation, in 1912 gave his parents' address as 11 Weymouth Square, Bath, very near to their address in 1911, and this was no doubt where William died in 1915
William Matthews 3 - see 17th Apr 2014 - a couple of snippets here; when he married, his bride Eliza was only 16 but it wasn't a "shotgun marriage" as they didn't have daughter Eliza for 4 years. Their parents were neighbours in Museum Street
After William's death in 1919 he left £3767 to Eliza and she moved back to London. When she died 22 years ater her address was given as 62 Abingdon Road, Kensington
(They may have had properties in both London and the West Country; on the marriage certificate above you can see her father's profession was "gentleman" and although her address was this house in Kensington, she died in 1941 in Wiltshire). 1939 Register was taken not long before she died and she was at the above address, listed as of "Private Means", some of this maybe the rent paid to her by the others in the house, an accountant and a family of railway-workers. She also had a companion/help in her 30s. When Eliza died in 1941 she was at 58 Ermine Street, Stratton St Margaret, Wiltshire, where she may have moved to for the duration of war, safer out of London, even though she was 90 years old, leaving £1333 to son Herbert (the Crystal Palace architect, who also lived in London and the West Country).
Tuesday 5th Februray 2019
Victor Stanley Matthews - see 12th Apr 2016 -
Violet May Matthews - see 10th Apr 2014 & 12th Apr 2016 - nothing new; even the closed record (probably Frank)on 1939 Register is still closed. She died on 24 Jul 1990, living at 134a Carfax Avenue, Tongham, Surrey:
leaving £115000, probably to her children (no doubt this included the flat above)
Violet E May Matthews - see 10th Apr 2014 & 13th Apr 2016
She was the sister who went home after the cinema and was killed in an air raid (see brother Leonard below).
Vivian John Matthews - see 13th Apr 2016 - nothing new
My father Walter Charles Matthews - see 11th Apr 2014 & 13th Apr 2016 - I think the account in 2014 is a good summary of his life and there is nothing new
Walter James Matthews - see 12th Apr 2014 & 18th Apr 2016 - nothing new except I may have found him in 1871 census aged 2 with his grandmother, in a green-grocers shop in Lyncombe (worryingly with a lady who had leprosy!)
On to the Williams on Friday...
Monday 4th February 2019
Silas Matthews 2 - see 31st Mar 2014 - was son of "senior" I dealt with yesterday. I told the (ultimately sad) story of his life, but now have a scan of his baptism:
unfortunately the marriage records of the Register Office have not been scanned. The only other snippet of information I have is that he was unable to pay the fine in Oct 1874 for not sending his children to school, due to being in hospital and thus unable to work, so he was imprisoned for 3 days. This did not do anyone any good at all, as he had TB and died 4 months later.
Silas Matthews 3 - I called him "junior" on 31st Mar 2014 - was son of 2 and his 2nd wife Sarah and he was baptised on 4 Aug 1861 at St Swithin aged almost 5, with siblings Robert and Sarah:
but again he married at the Register Office so no scan of that.
Silas James Matthews - see 31st Mar 2014 & 6th Apr 2016 - was his son and was baptised on 15 Feb 1878 at Christchurch Bath aged 7 months:
And I can now see all but one of the lines on the 1939 Register - see Sidney below - and a photo from round about that time:
Silas William James Matthews - see 5th Apr 2014 & 6th Apr 2016. I now see why I couldn't find his baptism. I have said that registrars and census enumerators were often, in the past, elderly and thus misheard names. This Silas was written in the records as "Cyrus" (and also called his mother Emma, but that was corrected at the time):
Nothing else new.
Stanley Matthews - see 6th Apr 2016 - nothing new
Sylvia May Matthews - see 7th Apr 2014 & 19th Apr 2016. At her death on 20 Dec 1979, the probate record said "...of Varley Hall of Residence, Coldean Lane" (Brighton University Halls of Residence). I'm not sure why this was her address; at 48 she was hardly likely to be a student. Maybe she was a matron of the Halls. She left £23827, presumably to her 2nd husband Alan and/or son Christopher.
Thomas Albert Matthews - see 7th Apr 2014 & 10th Apr 2016 - died on 7 Feb 1987 when he lived at 15 The Brow, Twerton
and he was cremated on 11 Feb 1987 at Haycombe Crematorium, leaving £8935, presumably to son Trevor as Beatrice had died in 1970 (also cremated at Haycombe, on 16 Mar)
Thomas Robert Matthews - see 10-11 Apr 2016 - I have found his baptism dated 5 Jul 1874 at St Swithin's:
and a possible emigration in 1896 aged 22 (although under his middle name of Robert, maybe he went against his parents' will). For lots of further detail see 2016.
Thomas William Matthews - see 7th Apr 2014 & 12th Apr 2016 - did have a baptism record in Bath:
but they moved to Canford, Dorset, then Worcester, as I said. Nothing new is forthcoming, but there is plenty ofdetail on 2016 blog.
Sunday 3rd February 2019
Roy Arthur Matthews, my cousin, see 5th Apr 2016 - married Sylvia Dabbs from Rochford, Essex and this is where she grew up, a bungalow called "The Nest":
She can be seen there in 1939 Register with her parents and 4 siblings, she herself 9 years old "at school", her father William a builder's labourer by trade but also in the Special Constabulary for the duration of the war. I see that her line has now been unredacted so she must have died in recent years.
Ruby Lilian Matthews - see 24th Mar 2014 & 5th Apr 2016
The only new record is electoral roll records in 2003-10 at 22 North View Close, Bath, and a picture from 2014, just the time she died:
Her 1939 Register line is still redacted, unfortunately.
Sarah Matthews - see 24th Mar 2014 - was baptised on 4 Aug 1861 aged 2 with siblings:
Also I have a scan of the banns for her marrisge. As you know, I don't much like banns, as the ceremony may not take place, but this one has a note on it that they were married on 10 Nov 1890. I did have a lot of trouble finding her, but now realise that after she married Joseph, who was 12 years younger than she was, she took 10 years off her age...
So, in 1891 they can be seen at 71 Avon Street, Bath and in 1901 at "4 Newborn Street" (as far as I can see, this address never existed and may have been a mishearing of "New Bond Street"), Joseph a fish dealer and Sarah "shellfish shopkeeper". By 1911 they were in the next street to Avon, son William now also a fishmonger, Westgate Buildings. Where they lived is now a Tesco Express with apartments above, no doubt they also lived over the shop. By 1939 they were at 18 Tennyson Road, a mile to the west, Joseph had retired, William married and living elsewhere, Sarah UDD. She was then 80, admitting to 68, but died 3 years later and Joseph followed 5 years after that.
Sarah Ann Matthews - also see 24th Mar 2014 - I have scans:
This was all fine, until I came across a 1939 Register which seemed to suggest she was living in Islington, London with a family called Alcock and 2 other UDDs. I had her death in Oct 1923, which I am tending to believe, as Charles did not leave her anything on his death 5 years later.
Sidney Albert Matthews - see 28th Mar 2014 & 6th Apr 2016 - when discussing the 1939 Register of Silas and his family - see Lily Louisa below - I hadn't realised the significance. Sidney is there aged 19, his record presumably recently unredacted despite his dying abroad. They were at 8 Weymouth Square, Bath and Sidney was described as "Coal Lorry Driver". As I told you, he died in Singapore in the Ordnance Corps in 1945.
Silas Matthews Senior my 3xg grandfather - see 28th Mar 2014 - was baptised 9 Nov 1783 in Gillingham, Dorset
and in answer to my query in 2014 I can see he married Martha in St Swithin's:
When she died on 22 Dec 1854 it was from hepatitis, and he re-married in just over a year. Silas died of "Natural Decay" aged 84, then his second wife Sophia died in 1878 of bronchitis aged 57.
Friday 1st February 2019
Phoebe Sophia Matthews - see 16th Mar 2014 & 3rd Apr 2016 - as elusive as ever, however I have traced the couple in Florida and discovered it is not our couple, as the dates of birth are wrong and they are black. None of the other records fit with date of birth and I cannot find a death under either Matthews or Hall.
Phyllis D Matthews - see 17th Mar 2014 & 3rd Apr 2016 - I have found her in 1939 Register, at Mount Rosa, as expected, with George & Rosina (her uncle & aunt). She is listed as "Confectioner's Shop Assistant" and a note is attached saying she became Vowles. This all tallies with what I knew, but it is always nice to have things confirmed. Findmypast and Ancestry have evidently processed her death in the past 3 years and so removed her redaction. Nothing new otherwise, as her dates are too recent for scans.
Robert Matthews 1 my 4xgreat uncle - see 17th Mar 2014 - is at the other extreme, very early, but I have found a scan of his baptism in 1787(hope you can read it - it says "2nd Sep Robert son of Edward and Mary Matthews"):
I still cannot track down the marriage, but having located her baptism 2 years earlier than she would admit, I suspect this may also be earlier. This of course supports the record I found in 1810, but as this was in Chichester I have my doubts...Anyway, I have now found her death on 16 Jun 1871 and subsequent burial at St Swithin's on 21 Jun:
Robert Matthews 2 - see 20th Mar 2014 - died aged 5, but I now have scans:
His nephew, Robert Matthews 3 - see also 20th Mar 2014 - I did think he maybe wasn't baptised, but I have now found a record dated 1861, when he was almost 7 years old:
when Robert, Silas and Sarah were baptised together at St Swithin's. He returned to that church to get married on 5 Mar 1876:
Robert Albert Matthews - see 21st Mar 2014 & 4th Apr 2016 - aka Albert. He was baptised on 20 Dec 1885 at Bath Christchurch:
No further scans, I am afraid.
Robert Edward Matthews aka Teddy - also see 21st/22nd Mar 2014 & 4th Apr 2016. These accounts paint a very detailed (if somewhat fragmented) picture, and I recommend you take the time to look, using the tabs for 2014 & 2016 above, then ctrl-F to find Robert Edward. I have scans:
Rosina Kathleen Matthews - see 4th Apr 2016 - was baptised on 23 Feb 1913 at Bath St Saviour, giving home address of Dafford's Villa
Marriages were both too recent for scans, I'm afraid, but in 1971 there was a directory entry, just after her second marriage (still under her old name of Vallance, as it took sometime to change these things) with an address of 109 The Oval, Englishcombe Park, and I have a photo of this road from some years before:
Tuesday 29th January 2019
Mary Matthews - see 10th Mar 2014 - nothing new except her baptism:
Mary Ann Matthews 1 - see 13th Mar 2014 - nothing new but scans:
Her niece was Mary Ann Matthews 2 - see 10th Mar 2014 & a little bit on 30th Mar 2016 - scans:
Mary Ann 1 & husband John (above) were witnesses at her marriage. Groom's father William Williams had run the Old Fox Inn, local pub, until his death 6 months before the wedding (both fathers had died but certificate doesn't say "deceased", which seems odd), when he had been living at Lisbon Cottage, Holloway, Bath. This was where Mary Ann was living, as you can see from the certificate above. Maybe she nursed both fathers. They probably knew each other from working in the same trade.
[This is the Young Fox Inn, Bridge Place, Holloway, Bath in 1965. The name may well have changed between 1876 and then, as the address appears the same. I suppose they may have rebuilt it and renamed it]
Mary Ann Matthews 3 - see 14th Mar 2014 & 30th Mar 2016 - after a few red herrings in the shape of a couple Herbert Swales and his wife Mary Ann, who emigrated to Australia, I have managed to find her baptism:
Welsh marriage records have not been scanned, but I do have the card relating to her husband's death:
Nellie Doris Iris Matthews - see 30th Mar 2016 - I can't bring you a baptism scan, as these only go up to 1914, and likewise the marriage is too recent. I have seen an electoral roll record from 2003-4 at Culverhayes, the nursing home where she spent the final years of her life
Norman Douglas Silas Matthews - I know nothing except that he was born in the Apr quarter of 1934 in Bath to Henry & Caroline née Spurrell and is probably one of the 4 redacted entries in their entry in 1939 Register at 6 Albert Buildings. I think he married Dorothy Beatrice Dyer in Jan 1967 in Bath, but cannot show any scans for these as they are too recent and they are both no doubt still alive.
Olive Ida Matthews - see 15th Mar 2014 & 30th Mar 2016 - I can see now that the 1939 Register entry has only 3 redacted lines and as I found a third child Kenneth born in 1935 this all makes sense. This was one of the few Register pages which was typewritten, rather than hand-written, and is typed on a clunky old machine with line spacing slightly larger than the form was designed for, so sometimes it doesn't match up, but was probably cutting edge technology at the time! I can also see that they both were cremated at Kensal Green Crematorium, Edward on 1 Dec 1971 and Olive 10 Feb 1976.
Olive Rosina Matthews - see 15th Mar 2014 & 3rd Apr 2016 - there are a couple of interesting points here. Although she was born and married in Bath, electoral roll of 1935 finds them in Newbury, Berkshire, living in High Street, before returning to Bath for 1939 Register (this may not have been a good plan, as Bath was on the receiving end of a lot of attention in WW2) and David was only 5 months old. In the end, he survived until 2014 and has only recently had his record revealed. As I said in 2016 their house was destroyed but they survived, Bill going on to run the Swan Inn, Tytherington, Gloucs and remarrying after Olive's death. I see now that she was buried with family in St James' Cemetery on 5 Apr 1947 (I was initially thrown by a burial there of a William Coffin Stainer, but it turned out to be his grandfather) and her husband in Gloucs in June 1973.
Monday 28th January 2019
Lucy Matthews - see 29th Mar 2016 - she was baptised aged 5 on 11 Mar 1911, with sister Kathleen:
At this time they had moved from 32 Devonshire Street, Marylebone across the road to number 53, then a month later the 1911 census found them at 18 Colin Road, Willesden. After their parents died, she and Kathleen lived together and can be seen in 1939 Register at 14 Lawrence Crescent, Wembley
As I said in 2016, she remained with them for decades and finally died in Jul 1986 in the Hendon area.
Madeline Matthews - see10th Mar 2014 & 29th Mar 2016 - I have now found Madeline & eledest child Audrey in 1939 Register, at 9 Claremont Buildings, Bath with 4 closed files, presumably Frederick, Ronald, Sylvia & Barbara, all babies. I have found that the death that was postulated in London was a Madeline Matthews, when "our" lady was Lomax. So, I believe the death in 1983 in Adelaide is probably correct, although I cannot locate it. Here is a photo of Madeline in 1960s, I think:
Margaret Edith Matthews - see 29th Mar 2016 - as often is the case, I have found new records from either end of her life; baptism on 16 Jun 1907 at Bath Abbey
and her death, 18 Mar 1981 aged 73, at home , which they evidently named Dundas after their previous home in Bath, Campden Hill, Ilmington, Shipston-on-Stour, Warwickshire
She left £18,611 but when Colin died at the same address 6 years later he left £234,184, the difference no doubt being largely the house.
Martha Matthews - see 10th Mar 2014 - nothing new
Saturday 26th January 2019
Lily Louisa Matthews - see 28th Mar 2016 - was a little difficult as I never quite got to the bottom of her exact name. It appears she was baptised on 14 Apr 1902 at St John, Peasedown as Elizabeth Louise, her father Silas James recorded as James. Her birth was registered as Lily Louise, but as that was her mother's name also it isn't surprising she was known as something else in the family. But in 1911 she was living with her aunt Elizabeth, so was called Lily there, however in 1939 when with her parents she was Elizabeth L. She died (still single), in Bath and was cremated on 11 Oct 1979 at Haycombe, under the name Elizabeth Louisa.
Louisa Matthews1 - see 7th Mar 2014 - I have found her baptism, but it appears to be a year later than I thought. This may be due to a typo somewhere or it may be correct. Her brother William had just died, so they may have been shaken up and rushed her off for baptism, although I am surprised they didn't also baptise 2-year-old Ethel at the same time.
On 5 Aug 1901 at St Stephen's she married Frederick John Ricketts and Ethel was a witness:
I have also now found voters' lists from 1940 and 1963; she can be seen at Vernon, Yale, British Columbia with sons Fred and John, listed as a Housewife, Fred as a driver, then a warehouseman.
Louisa Matthews2 - see 9th Mar 2014 - nothing new
Tuesday 22nd January 2019
Leah Matthews - see 6th Mar 2014 & 25th Mar 2016
(although banns can be untrustworthy, this one definitely took place, as the note top left says)
She had her first child in the workhouse because she was illegitimate, then followed her first marriage with Rosa and Ernest (Lily may be Leah). After Frederick died in 1906 she remarried, this time to James Flint, who had at least 4 children already. I wasted a lot of time trying to pin down his first wife, but she doesn't really matter, except as mother to these children. I think she was either Emily Ensten or Maria Farrell, but she died in 1900, possibly as a consequence of Stanley's birth. After her second marriage Leah produced Ivy, Jessie and Amy. Electoral roll records place her at 14 Gee Street in the Old Street part of Finsbury 1920-31. As I said in 2016, James died in 1937, so in 1939 Register, Leah was alone, a disabled pensioner, and died in 1953.
Leonard Harry Matthews - see 28th Mar 2016, when I said that in 1939 Register both siblings were redacted. I see that they have now released Violet's line, and she can be seen with date of birth 18 Jun 1916 describing her occupation as "light machinery and assembling small instruments and guage work". Leonard is still redacted, despite dying in 1995. Beatrice died 6 Jun 1989 and was cremated 13 Jun, Leonard in Jul 1995, cremated 20 Jul, both at Haycombe Crematorium. Royston, her son, is probably still living in the area, electoral roll records place him in Batheaston in 2002-3, daughter Heather married twice and died in Trowbridge, Wiltshire in 2014.
Leonard William Matthews - I haven't mentioned him before, as I know very little. He was born 10 Mar 1925 in Walcot to Robert & Henrietta née Jones, married Brenda Humphries in Bath in Apr 1950 and died in 2004 in Mendip, Somerset. He was the remaining closed file in 1939 Register with his mother and siblings at 22 Otago Terrace, as his father had died 9 years before.
Sunday 20th January 2019
John Matthews 1 - see 2nd Mar 2014. I have found his baptism:
and his first marriage:
Unfortunately I couldn't find a scan of his second marriage, to Hannah Daniel, originally a glover, then cook, although there are transcriptions, so I know it took place in Bath in Jul 1863. I have seen in the criminal records accounts of Hannah and her mother Mary in court for receiving stolen goods, in the 1850s, with descriptions linking the cases; Mary had lost her front teeth and Hannah was pockmarked. Despite this she must have been a good soul (maybe her mother was a bad influence) as she went on to be a nurse in Ilfracombe.
John Matthews 2 - see 3rd Mar 2014 & 23rd Mar 2016 - proceeding with the marriage to Agnes and subsequent emigration to America, it seems that he took a first trip to USA in 1913 when he was 19, then after the war went out again and established the tea business. He can be seen in directories of 1922-27 in Bristol, Connecticut, and Agnes joined him in 1923. He was naturalized in 1929 at Hartford, Connecticut and in 1930 census John and Agnes were living at the Home for Soldiers, Fitch. I can't see that the children went out with them, but don't know what happened to them back home if they didn't. It does look like Agnes travelled back to die in UK in 1955, but again I can't find her on any passenger list. We do have to bear in mind that this whole timeline may be false... and the fact that his middle name of Burton only appears on US documents doesn't help.
John Arthur Matthews - see 23rd Mar 2016 - nothing new
Jonathan Farland Matthews - see 3rd Mar 2014 where I told his full story but can now bring you scans of his baptism and marriage, both at St Swithin's:
As you can see, the marriage certificate gives his father as Jonathan too, but I think that was a typo/misunderstanding, as with that middle name it has to be him! I have also traced him through Directory entries; in 1847 & 1852 at Mary Le Port Street, a Freeman, then after marriage, settled with a family at 35 Northampton Street in 1864, shoemaker, and in 1884 at 2 Turner's Buildings as Porter. This was where he died 9 years later.
Kate Mary Ann Matthews - see 3rd Mar 2014
There are no scans for marriages in Hampshire, and I can't find her burial.
Kathleen Matthews - see 23rd Mar 2016
but nothing else.
Laura Emily Matthews - see 6th Mar 2014 & 25th Mar 2016 - nothing new
Saturday 19th January 2019
Jemima Matthews - see 1st Mar 2014 - nothing new
Jemima Ann Matthews - see also 1st Mar 2014 - I have, as I have said before, new information on either end of her life:
I don't know if you can see, but she was buried on 30 May 1900 at Chingford Mount Cemetery, home address still 9 Sedgwick Street, Hackney
Friday 18th January 2019
Iris Caroline Matthews - see 24th Feb 2014 - it seems FindmyPast haven't noticed she died in 2005, because she is still redacted, along with her 3 siblings, in Bath in 1939 Register. There is nothing new except an electoral register in 2003-5 when both she and Maurice lived at 47 Quarry Roack Gardens, Bath, which is in a "park home estate" not available on Google Streetview, so I cannot bring you a photo. This was presumably where she died.
Of the bunch of James Matthewses I studied in 2014 & 2016 I found nothing but frustration. So I will just summarize here in a list:
James1 born 1822 Bath: I have now found his baptism record:
However, although he can be seen in censuses of 1841 and 1851 in Walcot with parents and sibs, by 1861 he appeared to have married an Ann from Wiltshire and moved to London. Try as I will, I cannot match this up with a marriage and there are innumerable deaths under his name to provide alternatives.
James 2 (my 4xgreat-uncle) born originally in 1778 Gillingham, Dorset, died 1780, born 1781. His father died when he was 16, so I suppose he may have been the one who joined the army and went off to Egypt, lying about his age and consequently confusing me... All I can bring you is a really bad scan of his entry in the baptism record at St Mary the Virgin, Gillingham:
(Mind you, it is 237 years old)
James 3 I sorted the problem with his being called Eli by seeing a scan of the baptism record: as you can see, the registrar went to enter the wrong name in the column; Charles instead of James. He has corrected the address too, so wasn't firing on all cylinders that day, it seemed! Anyway, now I know that the 3-year-old who died in Oct 1871 was the one christened James in 1868:
The important James, however, is the one my database called James 4, my 3xg-uncle, born 1814 in Walcot - see 27th Feb 2014.
You will see I have the exact date now of his marriage (even closer to Eliza's birth than I thought!) I cannot find any burial records for Jane or James, except in London, which will not be correct as they lived at 22 Eastbourne, Bath with son George, still running the mason business until his own death in 1894.
Jane Matthews - see 28th Feb 2014 - my great great-aunt. No baptism I'm afraid, but I can bring you the scan of her marriage:
I have discovered a tenth child also, but as he died in infancy it isn't surprising he didn't show up in censuses etc.
Jane Ann Matthews - see 28th Feb 2014. I think she did die in childbirth a year after marriage, and her husband remarried. Scans:
(although the certificate clearly lies, stating "of full age", it has been transcribed as "minor", which she was, as she was not quite 19 and age of majority then was 21)
Tuesday 15th January 2019
Herbert Edward Matthews - see 20th Feb 2014 & 15th Mar 2016 - I have found his baptism now:
and his cremation on 11 Jul 1985 at Haycombe.
Herbert Frank Matthews - see same dates - again cremated at Haycombe, this time 7 Feb 1978. With regard to his absence in 1939 Register, I have found a record which may explain it. A Herbert Frank Matthews joined the Queen's Royal West Surrey Corps in April of that year, was with them for 2 years, then transferred out on 17 Apr 1941. I can't say for sure that it was him, but service personnel were excluded from the Register for fear of "giving away" information to the Enemy.
Herbert George William Matthews - see 21st Feb 2014 & 15th Mar 2016, where I gave much detail. However I can add a few more, he was baptised on 19 Jun 1898 at Bath Abbey:
I have also seen his name on the Navy List, compiled in 1919, stating he was a temporary Sub-Lieutenant in the Royal Navy Volunteer Reserve, presumably after hostilities ceased, aboard HMS President. It was 7 years later that he married and went off to Singapore. I have news of his end too - he was buried at St James's, Bath on 15 Jul 1937.
His father, Herbert William Matthews - see 22nd Feb 2014 & 15th Mar 2016, the architect and prominent person in Bath and London. I am very proud of this ancestor and his involvement in the great Empire Exhibition at Crystal Palace and forerunner of the Commonwealth Games, then sympathetic development of the Spa Hotel in Bath. the only new documentation is a scan of his marriage:
and some newspaper articles in the early 1950s mentioning his appearances in a Breach of Promise case between friends of his (not interesting). I see that when he died it was on 3 Mar 1954 in Westminster and he was buried 3 days later in the plot already occupied by his son at St James' in Bath. Apparently in 1970 they were joined by a Constance Matthews, but as I don't know her age, or marital state, I have no idea who she is.
Hilda Annie Matthews - see 24th Feb 2014 & 16th Mar 2016
The 1939 Register has been updated to show John William aged 13, at school, who must have died in recent years to clear his redaction. I assume that Hilda & William decided to evacuate the whole family, to avoid being separated in wartime, as a lot of families did if they could. Wiltshire was much safer than London, so they were wise. And they remained there for many years, William dying at 1 St Philips Road in 1994. As I said in 2014 Hilda died in Windsor in 1952, which is 70 miles away, near to London, so she may have had to have specialist medical care - she was only 55.
Horace George Matthews (my Dad's Uncle Horrie) - see 24th Feb 2014 & 16th Mar 2016. Also see 22nd Mar 2016 for my account of visiting the grave. Scans:
and those of his wife Elizabeth:
Monday 14th January 2019
Henry Matthews1 - see 14th Feb 2014. I have found new documents for either end of his life. He was baptised on 21 Nov 1830 at St Swithin's church
and he returned there 47 years later, as he was buried in St Swithin's churchyard on 21 Jan 1877
Henry Matthews2 - see 16th Feb 2014 & 12th Mar 2016 - was also christened at St Swithin's, on 31 Jan 1892
and I have some more photos to bring you:
I see from the photos that he was in the services in WW1, but I cannot be sure which are his records (I wish they included date of birth/address on all the medal cards). Two are likely possibilities: Private Henry Matthews with Royal Irish Rifles & Royal Fusileers and Sergeant Harry Matthews with Royal Engineers. (The other possibilty was Killed in Action in 1915 and medals sent to his widow in Yorkshire).
Henry Charles Matthews - see 14th Mar 2016 - I think I had the wrong 1939 Register, as he was not on it. I have found one now, in the right area, and has a wife Winifred. Unfortunately the date of birth is 3 years different and he is a conductor, but on the buses not musical... It seems the more I look the more confusing it becomes, and everybody is missing in 1901 census
Henry Francis Matthews - see 17th Feb 2019 & 14th Mar 2016. All I have to add is the marriage certificate scan:
Henry James Matthews - see 17th Feb 2014 & 15th Mar 2016
I have found his baptism, on 26 Oct 1851 at St James' Bath
I have also found wife Ann's death, in 1931 hence her absence from the Register 8 years later. No scans of marriage or burial, I am afraid. I have spent a very amusing but somewhat unproductive few hours chasing after a felon by the name of Henry Matthews, around the newspaper reports of courts in Glamorgan, only to find he was 30 years older than "mine"! He operated in a gang which included one John Matthews, who I had suspected was his father, but "my" John never left Bath! I must admit I am relieved, as they not only trespassed and poached, but raped and assaulted.
Sunday 13th January 2019
Harry Charles Matthews Senior - see 14th Feb 2014
In directories of Bath he can be seen listed in 1895 at 3 Pierrepoint Street as decorator with lodgings (hence calling himself "indoor porter" in 1901 census), in 1902 at 6 Lyncombe Place, decorator and 1911 32 Claverton Street a Carpet Layer. A newspaper item on his death told of another role he undertook:
His son Harry Charles Matthews Junior - also see 14th Feb 2014 I have straightened him out now. He was born 19 Mar 1893 in Walcot and christened there on 21 May:
and in 1922 in Bath he married Rhoda Rawlings, who in 1911 was a parlourmaid at 18 Belmont (a very salubrious address in those days
However, it seems she died in 1920, as by 1939 Register he was a widower. This Harry was a grocer, in Kelly's Directory at 5 Newark Street and 70 Walcot Street in 1919 and 1923.
70 Walcot St in 2012
(Newark Street was in an area badly bombed during WW2 and is now in the Southgate Shopping Centre). By 1939 Harry had moved to Bristol and is listed as "invalid". Maybe the two facts here are related! I cannot find a newspaper article regarding damage there, but have seen a map where the area is marked. In 1939 he was living with James Knowles, a decorator, who may have known his father, and Irene Knowles, probably this man#'s aughter. There is a note on the Register, to say that Irene became Matthews, written in 1944, then Toogood, written in 1952. I see that she married Harry in 1943, then he died 3 years later. She married Robert Toogood in 1952 and died 1966. The address in 1939 468 Gloucester Road, Bristol, was where Harry died
Harry Francis Matthews - see 14th Feb 2014 & 8th Mar 2016. As I said in previous studies, in 1915 he married Prudence Mackins, who at the time was a tailoress. By 1932 she had a shop, although I can't find out what she sold at that time, at 16 Talbot Street, Leek, Staffordshire. It seems that they moved to Stoke quite soon before 1939, as Prudence is in Leek still in 1936, with her shop. Looking at a map of the area at that time, it is obvious why they went there, as all around them were a multitude of railway lines, all gone now, as are the collieries and steel works they worked with. She ran her pub from home, but all I can find about this was that it was listed as a Beer House, not a pub as such with a name. I had thought it may have been the Trafalgar and gave the road its name, but it was the battle it was named after. The area just to the west was known as Etruria, and you may be familiar with the name from my Canal Blog, as Josiah Wedgewood and his potteries took over the area with the associated canals. When Harry died on 10 Dec 1972 and Prudence on 28 Jan 1974 they were living at 14 Cavour Street, Etruria. Nowadays numbers start at 64, as the road has been realigned.
Saturday 12th January 2019
George Albert Matthews - see 10th Feb 2014 & 8th Mar 2016 - nothing news but scans:
George Charles Matthews - see 8th Mar 2016. I have seen the school admissions records for him; 10 Sep 1907 he was admitted to St John's Infants School, Worcester (the home address was 1 Skinner Street, which is in the area known as St John's)
In the summer of 1910 he moved on to the Boys' School but on 1 Apr 1912 he had to leave, as his father died, and entered an orphanage. I'm not sure how long this was for, but the family was in chaos, as the father William died not long after they lost the baby Elizabeth. Mother Elizabeth presumably had to resort to an orphanage as she couldn't cope. Oddly, his brother William (2 years older) remained at the local school until 1913.
George Henry Matthews - see 10th Feb 2014 - nothing new except a scan of Emily's second marriage:
George James Matthews - also see 10th Feb 2014 - nothing new
Gertrude Annie Matthews - see 10th Feb 2014 & 8th Mar 2016. I see from the scan that her marriage was on 1 Sep 1912 at St Paul's, Bremhill, Wilts
No baptism scan for her, I'm afraid, but there is for her husband Fred
At her death, she was cremated at Haycombe Cemetery on 6 Mar 1972.
Harold Leslie Matthews - see 13th Feb 2014, when information petered out when he emigrated. I have now seen some Australian records and know his life afterwards. As I said, he travelled in Aug 1923 to Australia, saying he would settle as a farmer. After 10 years working on the railways I must admit I was surprised, but that was probably what they wanted to hear. He did settle well enough, marrying Mary Ann Gill Smith in 1927 in Maitland West, New South Wales and they can be seen there in electoral roll of 1931, at 23 Bull Street, Harold working as a "winch driver" (and Mary Ann "home duties"). During WW2 he enlisted 1939-48 in Newcastle, NSW into the Army Citizen Military Forces. After demob he returned home and can be seen with Mary Ann in 1949 at 22 Cross Street, Lambton, NSW, working as an engine driver. By 1958 he had moved on to driving a crane and lived at 12 Miller Street, Mayfield, Newcastle, then retired from driving in 1963, aged 65 to live at 46 Baker Street, Mayfield, but he kept earning, working as a "casemaker", maybe piecework from home. He may have continued this up to his death in 1972 aged 74, then Mary Ann followed in 1975 aged 67.
Friday 11th January 2019
Frederick Matthews2 - see 7th Feb 2014 & 7th Mar 2016 - nothing new:
In the search for heir Marjorie Beber, I see she was born in 1906, i.e. only 5 years after Frederick, so cannot be a daughter. In 1939 she can be seen with a Joseph (born 1875) and Mary E Matthews, who I do not know. So Joseph may be a cousin of Frederick I am not yet aware of..
Frederick Herbert Matthews - see 7th Feb 2014, when I thought he died in 1876. I see now that he married Ellen Kettlety on 18 Sep 1875 in Bradford-on-Avon, her birthplace:
He is with the family in 1881 census, and by then they have 2 children. A third was born shortly afterwards; William Henry, aka Henry, and he can be seen in 1891 census with his grandparents, Ellen's parents, with his siblings, but the parents are nowhere to be seen. In 1901 Ellen resurfaces, calling herself married, but still no sign of Frederick, still in Bradford-on-Avon. She was listed as a woollen-weaver and son Henry a gardener, as in 1911 at 10 Kingston Road, Bradford, with Henry and a boarder. This was the address where she died in 1920, leaving her effects to Frederick junior and Florence, presumably her house to Henry. The only records I could find for Frederick senior, which may explain this, were criminal records for larceny on several occasions, each time with a term of imprisonment. The ones I found were too early to account for these gaps in the census, but he may have started young! (The records I was looking at ended in 1892). There was a death in Warminster, Wiltshire under his name in 1911, which may explain why she said "married" in censuses and "widow" at her death.
Geoffrey William Matthews - see 7th Mar 2016 - he was the cousin who emigrated to Australia and was killed in a car accident. I have nothing new to add except my puzzlement at where he was in 1939 Register. He was 11 but wasn't at home with his parents in west Wickham so must have been evacuated. I hadn't realised this.
Later: I have just found his brother Roy in Brighton and there is Geoffrey spelled Jeffery! They were living with a Harry Stone, master gardener, at 42 North Road, Preston, Brighton and I now have the exact date of birth 15 Feb 1928.
He left these shores 10 years later and I still cannot find a death in Australia.
George Matthews - see 10th Feb 2014 & 7th Mar 2016. baptism
I was concerned about an apparent daughter Phyllis with George & his wife in 1939 Register, but I have confirmed (now her file is open) she was his niece (the Register did not give relationship status). A nice touch was that George called his house on Mount Road "Mount Rosa" after Rosina, his wife. George was a "scrap iron and metal sorter", very useful in wartime, and Phyllis worked in a sweet shop, Rosina kept house.
Tuesday 8th January 2019
Florence Minnie Matthews - see 6th Feb 2014 & 1st Mar 2016 - I can confirm the details given:
and that after marriage they lived next door to her parents. I have described the 1939 Register, and have sought the other children, but they could be evacuated anywhere. I think Florence died in Apr 1948 in Willesden aged 43 and Alfred in 1960 in nearby Hendon aged 58.
Florence Sarah Matthews - see 3rd Feb 2014 & 2nd Mar 2016, where I have told the detailed story.
There are no new records/scans.
Florence Valentine Matthews - see 6th Feb 2014 & 2nd Mar 2016. I see now that she was baptized on 21 Feb 1898 aged 3 with little brother george:
Apart from this there is nothing new.
Frances Annie Matthews - I haven't covered her before, as all I really know is at her birth. She was born on 26 Dec 1904 to Henry & Annie née Hudson and christened on 15 Jan 1905 at St James, Clerkenwell:
She can be seen in 1911 census aged 7 living at 6 Rheidol Terrace, St Peter's Street, Islington with parents, sibs and 2 boarders. I had thought the next record was marriage to Robert W Warner in Islington but 1939 Register had thrown a spanner in the works! This record has all the features of a second marriage, in other words the Frances concerned was Matthews by marriage, not birth. And her date of birth is all wrong. She has a couple of children, surname Matthews, and a couple of closed files. So, I hesitate to attach this and the subsequent death in 1953 in Edmonton...
Frederick Matthews1 - see 5th Mar 2016. I have located him in 1901 census, at Foxham with his widowed grandmother Ann Newman, helping her out on the farm, along with his brother Alfred, aged 6. The search for a marriage document has produced banns (which are not worth a lot, as the ceremony may have never taken place)
but in this case I have seen transcription of the ceremony, on 19th Aug 1916, stating he was a 29 year old chauffeur from Chippenham, and she a domestic servant aged 24 from Great Somerford. Fathers are named as George Matthews and Andrew Porter, both labourers. I have also discovered his middle name was William. Again it was difficult to trace the children in 1939 and beyond, because I have no idea where they were evacuated or if they stayed there. Frederick died in 1965 in Chippenham aged 79. I found this ancestor somewhat emotional, as my late mother loved Malmesbury, and spent a lot of time there. Frederick's great-grandfather was my Dad's great great grandfather, which made him his 2nd cousin once removed I believe. Mabel grew up there and all these places mentioned here are less than 10 miles away.
Monday 7th January 2019
Ethel Georgina Matthews - see 2nd Feb 2014 - I now have her baptism aged 1 month:
and her marriage:
Albert, as I said in 2014, had been born in Cornwall and emigrated with his family at the age of 5. He can be seen in Philadelphia with his family in 1900 census, aged 18, a silk weaver. In May 1906 he was naturalized and on 18 Apr 1910 they were married. Other scans are death records. Albert died in 1966 in Delaware Valley Hospital and was buried at Whitemarsh Cemetery, Prospectville. Ethel died on 16 Aug 1981 in Elizabethtown, Pensylvania and was buried at North Cedar Hill Cemetery, alongside the grave of her nephew Alfred J B Matthews, who died aged 8
NB I have tracked them down in 1930 census, rooming in New Haven , Connecticut, Albert an iron worker with a construction company, but no sign in 1940 (he gave home address as North Percy Street, Philadelphia 2 years later on draft papers).
Ethel Kathleen Matthews - see 3rd Feb 2014 (the one who was designated Imbecile)
There are no scans for baptism or marriage, so all I can bring you is the entry for her death at the Lnatic Asylum in Wells:
This shows she was admitted on 21 Nov 1911 (so from the Workhouse) and died there on 21 Jul 1921.
Evelyn May Matthews - see 1st Mar 2016 (please do, it's a dramatic story!). Looking for family members in 1939 I have tracked down Leonard & Violet, as expected, at 18 Third Avenue, with Elizabeth Giddings, their grandmother. Looking into this, I see that she too was killed in the air-raid in 1942, along with Eric, Violet and Evelyn, aged 68. I can also now see her name on the memorial plaque in the gardens
Going back to the 1939 Register, the only entry I can see for Evelyn is in Bristol with a couple called Frank & Mary Ann Matthews and their probable son Humphrey, all of whom I don't know...
Florence May Matthews - see 1st Mar 2016 - another dramatic tale! There were even more staff than I thought at Fanhams, as records extend onto other pages. I still know nothing about her husband Sidney Webb, and there are se vel 1939 Register records for that name. As I don't know his date of birth or if he was local, I cannot find his birth or even his death. He could be the Sidney Webb from Devizes who married Beatrice Hawkins there in 1912, but then again he may not. If so, he died in Chippenham in June 1975 and his middle name was Alfred, Beatrice died in 1959. I think Florence died in 1993 in Stroud, Gloucestershire aged 92.
Sunday 6th January 2019
Ellen Matthews my great great-aunt - see 1st Feb 2014 - I can confirm they remained in Germany after their marriage, as daughter Anna was baptised there on 26 Sept 1864, and unfortunately died there before she was 5 years old, on 18 March 1869. As she was named after Phillipp's mother Anna Maria Ottilia née Kurtz this must have been a great tragedy to all.
baptism death of Anna
Philipp was born 17 Jul 1839 in Frankfurt to Johann Bernhard Schirold and Anna Maria Ottilia nee Kurtz, elder sister Eva born 1831 in Frankfurt and died thereaged 48 in 1880. Philipp himself died there on 8 Nov 1882 aged 43. Ellen followed on 3 Jul 1919 aged 76 (can't have been easy to be a Brit in Germany then!)
Ellen Beatrice Matthews - see 1st Feb 2014 & 14th Feb 2016 - as I said, her husband moved around the country so their children were born in Bristol, Birmingham and Bradford (Ronald, Maisie & Beryl respectively) and Maisie died there aged 5. I can't find them in 1939, but as Ellen died in Bradford 6 years later, they were probably there. I have found son Ronald, who married in 1935, settled in Pudsey, nearby, with what could be a grandchild. Ellen has no scans etc, I am afraid.
Emma Jane Matthews - see 14th Feb 2016 - nothing new except a possible emigration, sailing from Liverpool to New York on board the Teutonic on 17 Aug 1903, listed as a 16-year-old servant. However, her name looks more like "Monthouse" to me, and she is crossed out with NOB by this, possibly Not On Board?
Friday 4th January 2019
Happy New Year Everyone. Hope it's a good one for you.
Elizabeth Matthews3 - see 1st Feb 2014
Although I can find nothing new, the scans confirm my story:
No burial scan, unfortunately, but no doubt it would be in Birmingham.
Elizabeth Kate Matthews - see 1st Feb 2014 & 15th Feb 2016. I now have her baptism record, conveniently giving both parents' names for confirmation:
The marriage on Isle of Wight was disproven by the scan showing father named as James. I know this is not always reliable, but I had my doubts anyway, as I said. There is one in 1914 in Peckham but she is a widow, so not Matthews. I can't find her with middle initial in 1939 and there are far too many without, as I said in 2016.